Twin Galaxies congratulates John Mccurdy...

[maximumsteve]

https://www.twingalaxies.com/feed_details.php/6133/john-mccurdy-reclaims-his-donkey-kong-crown/25

[naujoks]

How come TG accepted his record, without him having to go through that whole pre and post game spiel that everbody else has to do when submitting a score?

[jace hall]

Its not accepted at TG, and it is not considered a TG World Record.

However TG may from time to time congratulate players on achievements achieved elsewhere.

TG has no desire to be elitist or provincial when it comes to achievement. We all enjoy the activity of video games together!

-Jace

[naujoks]

I have noted that Robbie (listed as Nr 1 on TG) in the video submitted 2 days ago didn't seem to have to go through the extensive pre-flight requirements. Unless these were cut in the video submitted to the public.

[Snowflake]

can you be specfic and give an example of anyone else submitting to tgsap that had to do something robbie didnt? if you're talking about the obsolete rules from days of corrupt refs, we no longer enforce those corrupt rules that as far as i can tell where just a way of screwing over non refs and keeping favorites on tops.  we now have same rules for everyone, which i gather is your real concern and a good concern.  if however there was something robbie didnt do that we currently expect of others, point me to it and i'll gladly dispute his score

[naujoks]

I'm referring to the rules of submitting a DK score, found here:

https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthread.php/168098-Twin-Galaxies-Donkey-Kong-(Arcade)-Recording-Rules

Even just the pre-game requirements make it completely unpractical for me personally to ever submit a score since I can't possibly pull out the machine, go around it with a camera, open it etc every time I play.
That's why I wonder why Robbie's video doesn't show the whole procedure.

[bensweeneyonbass]

You'll find those rules you linked to are an artifact of a bygone era at TG. It's my understanding they were intended to simplify the adjudication process back when people were mailing videos into refs for adjudication. That being said I opine that it put an absolutely unnecessary burden on those submitting performances. To your point, it's prohibitive for a lot of people. Owning a DK cab shouldn't be a requirement for submitting a performance to TG, but the old rules make it such that you basically have to own one to have that much control over what and when you're filming. Anyway if someone submits to TG with a video that includes the entire performance and confirms it's done using one of the original board sets, the adjudicating community in this day and age is likely to be satisfied.

Edit - you'll note that the date on that thread is two years after the community adjudication system was put in place. I can see how that is confusing. There was something posted by Jace or TG at or around that time that indicated putting that thread up was for historical purposes or something like that. Let me try to find that.

[Snowflake]

oh dang 2017 its dated so i guess technically that is the tgsap rules whatever, those are crazy, and even crazier they were reiterated tgsap. yeah robbie doesnt have to do that nor does anyone else. like you said you wouldnt be able to submit and i'm sure alot of others wouldnt either.  if those rules were enforced alot of scores be removed.

heres the actual rules
1. outright rule: video must be direct upload tg
2. must be good enough evidence to convince adjudciators, whatever that means (see my recommendations below)
not rules, but for all pratcical purposes might as well be
1. show the entire game
2. show the board
3. bootup is optimal but you might be able to get away without it

[creech]

jv will kick your ass

[naujoks]

What does direct upload to TG mean?
Aren't the showing of the board, ROMs, CPU & joystick mandatory as well? Are high score saving kits allowed?
I'm surprised that these rules as currently displayed aren't recent. They are extremely off putting, particularly since it's for arguably one of the hottest arcade games around. They are possibly also the reason why the TG high score list is comparatively short, in contrast to the DKforum's.

[bensweeneyonbass]

"Direct upload to TG" means that when you create a submission thread there's the opportunity for you to upload a video directly to the site and attach it permanently to the thread. That's a requirement - there must be permanent video evidence attached to the submission thread.

None of the other stuff is "required" but I would seriously doubt a submission would be accepted without it. As for showing the control panel, I would consider doing that from a purist's perspective, just to see if it's a 4-way or an 8-way. But really that's kind of a matter of history and not a matter of adjudication in my opinion. I would say showing the PCB is basically required by adjudicators but it's not a hard rule. High score kits are cool as far as I've seen.

[bensweeneyonbass]

The issue is that it's a peer review process. Peers will evolve over time. At this time I wouldn't see anyone's submission getting rejected because they didn't show the control panel but I WOULD see it getting rejected without showing the board.

[Snowflake]

boards are supposed to be original and so a save kit would technically be against the rules but theres a chance people might give it a pass if it doesnt affect game play

the score list here is bound to be longer since this is all inclusive and so takes from tg and other places. so that alone might be an unfair metric, but i do agree the listing of obsolete rules is a problem

one of the biggest issues with twin galaxies is its tailored to avid users. its not well set up for new people or one time submitters. and thats unfortunate since alot of people only have one score they really want attention for.  if theres a lot of scores you'd like to submit on, i can tell that tg, once you get over the overhead of learning your way around a not sure user-friendly system becomes pretty good at what it does. but yeah, if you just wanna submit one score then i have to agree with your criticisms.

[Vern]

as I understand it the score list here includes all kong scores. both original PCB and MAME in one list. TG separates them in different tracks, where MAME scores compete with MAME scores and original hardware scores are kept separate.  Im not sure all the kong people use TG either as well. So TG isnt the only place to look for Kong scores. tho I think it has a better review/adjudication process.

I've seen scores get rejected for not showing the PCB and they should be. I also think different tracks require different things. for example showing control panels seems to be a DK thing.  Tho there is a recent post suggesting that MAME scores not using WolfMame should require a video of the performance showing the Controls 100% of the game.

but yeah, its not a 1 ruleset fits all. the rules vary by track. but for the most part. MAME needs a INP recording of the performance in WolfMame and PCB submissions NEED the dipswitch settings and serial numbers shown, as well as the board itself to verify no modification.

If you're capable of putting up a score worth submitting to TG, I dont care where you play. They will help you out Im sure. If not, maybe find a new arcade.  You can even get what you need through the coin door in many cases.


as far as John's score. yeah TG wrote an  article congratulating him on beating the other kid. but they did not immediately put his score up. He has not submitted it for review that I have seen and  the other kid remains in the top slot on the board.  (I hear he is also still calling himself the WR holder because of this. supposedly did some interview, calling himself #1 in some new kong propaganda film being made.)

[naujoks]

I did submit my game to TG in the meantime, and it was accepted.
Some adjudicators expressed surprise that the rules as posted on TG are the way they are.