Will anyone ever hold the DK, DKJr, and DK3 records at the same time?

[VON]

I think if you exclude marathons, Dean's 1.2 DK score probably IS the hardest existing record to beat in all of classic gaming. (Include marathons and it's a different story.)

You're supposed to say, "In my opinion", before making statements like that Chris.

In my opinion, Aart's MAME score of 1,769,990 on Galaxian displays his mastery of that game is at a level above anyone's current mastery level of Donkey Kong.  Aart's score was one of the first inps I downloaded purely to enjoy watching a wizard at work - no intention to study the game, just wanted to watch him do his thing.  It was amazing.  It is, still, an amazing game.

But Galaxian is a different game than Donkey Kong.  Different skill sets are required.  I'm pretty good at Donkey Kong, so my appreciation for its record will always be a bit tempered.  I'm average at Galaxian, so my appreciation for its record may be overblown.  And that's why, this is my opinion. 

[DiggingInNY]

I think if you exclude marathons, Dean's 1.2 DK score probably IS the hardest existing record to beat in all of classic gaming. (Include marathons and it's a different story.)

You're supposed to say, "In my opinion", before making statements like that Chris.

In my opinion, Aart's MAME score of 1,769,990 on Galaxian displays his mastery of that game is at a level above anyone's current mastery level of Donkey Kong.  Aart's score was one of the first inps I downloaded purely to enjoy watching a wizard at work - no intention to study the game, just wanted to watch him do his thing.  It was amazing.  It is, still, an amazing game.

But Galaxian is a different game than Donkey Kong.  Different skill sets are required.  I'm pretty good at Donkey Kong, so my appreciation for its record will always be a bit tempered.  I'm average at Galaxian, so my appreciation for its record may be overblown.  And that's why, this is my opinion.

Good one. Games like Galaxian and Mappy are very fast paced, require very skilled movement, and can be extremely overwhelming. For Donkey Kong, it's all about point pressing. Though I'm not very good at Donkey Kong (I really don't play the game at all)and I respect the record, the action on screen is not as insane as Mappy or Galaxian, which continues to get harder and harder the further along you advance. Correct me if I'm wrong, Donkey Kong's difficulty tops out at around Loop 5.

[Scoundrl]

I know my opinion is biased, but I would have to say that Greg Bond's 1.277M point game of Mappy is tougher to beat.

Being a pretty good Mappy player I was always impressed with Gregs 1.2m score but after seeing the famous 1m point MAME performance That record is a lot less impressive. There are tales of 20 million point games done overseas and I see no reason not to believe in those.

Deans 1.2m DK score is among the most prestigious scores for sure, as is Arts Galaxian. Tony Temples TGTS Missile Command score is pretty damn impressive too. Georges DK3 score also out there. Most of the major arcade scores are at a level now that it requires a true mastery of the game to even come close to it and I personally enjoy watching almost any game played at that level (Dark Tower and The Glob are excluded for obvious reasons)


As far as the OP's question, all three of these games have scores so high and so specialized I really doubt anyone will even get all three. We may again see DK (arcade) and DK Jr held by one person but I just dont think anyone will put what it takes to get the DK3 score. We were just talking about DK3 last night, I enjoyed the few practice games I got in and am looking forward to getting a little better before BOTA 3.

[Xermon54]

Yeah, Donkey Kong's difficulty tops at Stage 5. However, the "point press" factor changes everything. The game itself isn't very hard, but when you point press, you decide the difficulty of the game. And another aspect that can make Donkey Kong hard is the randomness (which is not really a "skill" thing, but if you take into consideration that "not getting pissed off" is a skill, then you have to have a lot of skills to face the randomness!)

And I don't think it's accurate to determine the difficulty of a game based on the fast-paced action of the game. Another example is Donkey Kong Jr. Although it's a fairly easy game and slow game, it can be very hard in term of strategy when you really try to point press as hard as possible.

I personally think that for every game (except patternable games like Pac-Man), the player decide the difficulty of the game. Correct my maths if I'm wrong!

[DiggingInNY]

20 million points in Mappy? I'll believe it when it see it.

[TheSunshineFund]

Mappy is extraordinarily popular overseas.  Goro's likeness still appears like Pac-Man does here on lots of random shit.  I believe Mappy marathons happened over there.

[DiggingInNY]

You're right. I have read that Mappy is much more popular outside the US. For me I like the thrill of fast paced games with quick reactions needed to succeed.

[ChrisP]

I guess in order to speak on this with real authority, one would need to have significant experience *as a proficient player* with all of the games that would be under contention for "toughest record."

Since I don't personally have that, I went with a more objective measure: the main reason that I cite Dean's score as the toughest is simply that it has the most "context" of any record due to the game having more competition than any other (by far).

Only on DK do you have dozens of players pushing the game as hard as they can, for years, all playing fairly regularly, and yet Dean's score is significantly higher than the 3 (very tightly-spaced scores) directly below it, which are themselves significantly ahead of much of the top 20.

If the competition on other titles were as intense and as incentivized as DK is, where people specialized at them over a long-term period, I have to wonder what kind of scores we would start to see on Mappy, Galaxian, et al. We have that kind of specializing in DK, yet there isn't even a contender for the next 1.2.

[gstrain]

I know my opinion is biased, but I would have to say that Greg Bond's 1.277M point game of Mappy is tougher to beat.

Being a pretty good Mappy player I was always impressed with Gregs 1.2m score but after seeing the famous 1m point MAME performance That record is a lot less impressive. There are tales of 20 million point games done overseas and I see no reason not to believe in those.

Here's links to video of the famous 1M point Mappy MAME performance (in 5 parts).  Level 50, 1,075,810, No Deaths.  Complete mastery.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxK-_TZnDgc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHAfjDdV3V8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSPmOtPK52o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtbNYj2mrws
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8ixgSMaQZY

[gstrain]

Mappy is extraordinarily popular overseas.  Goro's likeness still appears like Pac-Man does here on lots of random shit.  I believe Mappy marathons happened over there.

I think "overseas" just means Japan, right?  I know it was very popular in Japan and left a legacy there, but I've never heard of it being that popular in any other countries.

[TheSunshineFund]

Yeah Japan.

[ChrisP]

Here's links to video of the famous 1M point Mappy MAME performance (in 5 parts).  Level 50, 1,075,810, No Deaths.  Complete mastery.

I Kreygasmed before Part 1 was even over.

[VON]

Here's links to video of the famous 1M point Mappy MAME performance (in 5 parts).  Level 50, 1,075,810, No Deaths.  Complete mastery.

I Kreygasmed before Part 1 was even over.

Indeed, that replay is craze amaze.  Apparently someone brought this recording to the attention of Greg Bond and he seemed to think it was done on an easier romset, saying something like, "I could easily get a million on my first man on that romset."

Now, I don't really know Mappy, and Greg is one of the nicest CAGers around, but to me, his response is typical of CAGers who have put entirely too much stock in TG records as actual World records.  Suck it up Greg, there's a Japanese Mappy player who is probably better than you, deal with it, or better yet, embrace it. 

[TheSunshineFund]

In all fairness though, Greg's likely played more Mappy than any other US resident that we know of.  I don't know the game well enough to comment on any specifics but as you mentioned, Greg is a stand up guy and I've never seen any sour grapes from him at all when it comes to gaming and appreciating other performances so I really don't know.

[ChrisP]

Greg is correct at least to the extent that it's not the same ROMset played in the US, but rather the original Japanese version. (Proof is at 12:45 on the last part, where Goro is called "Nyamco"). Is the Japanese version easier? I don't know.

It's also worth mentioning that we know very little about that video, the player, etc.

For all we know, this performance was cut together from save states or involves some form of tool assistance. We really can't know without the original INP. If the INP is on that ReplayBurners site I can't find it.

I have to say, my instinct is that the gameplay is almost inhumanly perfect. Throw in a death or some botched bonus stages or something and I would say "okay, this is legit, he's just really good," but when a performance is flawless from first to last board, I can't look at it without at least some skepticism.