Author Topic: Robbie's 1.272  (Read 52065 times)

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Offline muscleandfitness

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #150 on: June 18, 2021, 05:23:36 pm »


i need more  points to put up my 992 k score PLS SIR CAN I HAVE SOME MORE  <Allen> <Allen> <Billy> <Billy>
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Offline homerwannabee

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #151 on: June 18, 2021, 06:06:30 pm »


i need more  points to put up my 992 k score PLS SIR CAN I HAVE SOME MORE  <Allen> <Allen> <Billy> <Billy>
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Offline Snowflake

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #152 on: June 20, 2021, 07:58:04 pm »
what he left out is how people here told robbie that it wasnt cheating and ok and he should go for it.  Robbie expressed concerns it was cheating, was told its not, went on to try to prove it was (and honestly i think robbie failed to prove it was cheating just like others thought), and was repeatedly told it wasnt and that he should just try to get the wr with it.

So if I go over to TG, of which I am a site member, and I egg someone on to submit a spliced speedrun, that would make it not-cheating, because technically a site member gave them permission?
oh please use tg analogies, cause unlike the copie kong forums, tg does things the right way. you'll notice tg approved the score so if you wanna use a tg analogy, yes, tg approves this.
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Offline Snowflake

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #153 on: June 20, 2021, 08:00:24 pm »
also i've been meaning to ask, exactly how does you guys hypocrisy on sourced scores work?

i noticed you inclded billy's score, and have the nerve to list TG as a source even though TG redacted it. Isnt that liking claiming vaccines cause autism and citing the lancelot as a source despite the lancelot redacting?

i also noticed you dont list robbies new score with tg as a source

you're standards for whether or not TG is a valid source seem very inconsistent.

just saying
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Offline wolfman24

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #154 on: June 20, 2021, 10:57:35 pm »
If you don't care why do you care so much snowflake  ROFL
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Offline dnickolas

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #155 on: June 21, 2021, 12:16:53 am »
also i've been meaning to ask, exactly how does you guys hypocrisy on sourced scores work?

i noticed you inclded billy's score, and have the nerve to list TG as a source even though TG redacted it. Isnt that liking claiming vaccines cause autism and citing the lancelot as a source despite the lancelot redacting?

i also noticed you dont list robbies new score with tg as a source

you're standards for whether or not TG is a valid source seem very inconsistent.

just saying

That's because TG did a blanket redaction because of the evidence concerning later games, and dkf went out of their way to give credit for the legit performance despite future shenanigans.

And do you even play dk? Why do you care?
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Offline ersatz_cats

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #156 on: June 21, 2021, 12:27:33 am »
also i've been meaning to ask, exactly how does you guys hypocrisy on sourced scores work?

i noticed you inclded billy's score, and have the nerve to list TG as a source even though TG redacted it. Isnt that liking claiming vaccines cause autism and citing the lancelot as a source despite the lancelot redacting?

i also noticed you dont list robbies new score with tg as a source

you're standards for whether or not TG is a valid source seem very inconsistent.

just saying

Are you okay?

TG is allowed to be wrong sometimes.

DKF retained Billy's 933K because it was actually done at an actual live event, and is genuinely believed to be real. Oh, AND because it predates any proven cheating. (You'll notice they haven't added Billy's later Twitch scores, which happened after the cheating, even though there's no particular evidence against those specific scores. The spectre of cheating is enough.) The "TG" has just been retained is all - I think Dwayne Richard, who was TG at the time, witnessed it.

Keep in mind, I don't really agree with that approach. In my opinion, once someone cheats, everything they've done is suspect, unless they provide some full contrition and accountability. Speaking as a verified 100k player (which, given the participation I see in this thread, might as well be a god damn kill screen) I think Billy's name shouldn't be on the scoreboard at all. But the fact that I disagree with DKF's approach to that doesn't mean their approach is not rational or consistent, or that the people who agree with that position are somehow conspiring in bad faith.

I'm just not sure when so many of the TG crew got so soft on cheaters. What happens when someone just says "I cheated this run I'm submitting, but since you won't be able to prove it, you have to accept it"? Will you verify that, too? Where exactly is the line, if not openly attempting to cheat?
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Offline homerwannabee

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #157 on: June 21, 2021, 04:43:55 am »
TG accepting the score might come back to bite them later on.  I wouldn't be surprised to see this as evidence brought up in the Billy Mitchell suit.
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Offline Snowflake

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #158 on: June 21, 2021, 08:47:34 am »
ok, i guess with shorter answers i opened myself up to misinterpretation

My issue with the TG source, is although yes tg was the source at one point, its no longer the source. If dkf reevaluated the score and still believes it, then its dkf who believes it not tg.  TG is no longer a valid source for billys score.  It was at first but isnt now.  Some people still believe vaccines cause autism even after the lancet retraction, theyr'e allowed to still believe that, but they shouldnt be using the lancet as a source.  Anyway, my only real point there is i see some inconsitency but thats admmittedly the less important of my points.

TG can of course make mistakes.  It didnt just make mistakes in the old days, it makes mistakes now and score gets disputed all the time.  I was provided an analogy and following up.  Perhaps analogies should be discontinued and the focus should be on the facts if analogies create more confusion instead of clarity.  George, i'm curious as to why you think it bites tg in the ass, the community accepted it, dont see how that hurts TG itself, especially when it was the right call.  Still at least you seem to be at least hinting at things that matter and i respect that.

finally i'm loving the "why do you care" angle.  yeah, how many people complained about todds scores played any of the games he played?  Dragster was one of the worst games ever, if any of you did play it, i'd wager it was only because of the dispute and most people wouldnt even know dragster existed if not for todd.  First its about if robbie cheated, then its about if he thought he cheated, then its about if what he thought was true and didnt think is cheating would you view it as cheating if he was right, now its about why do i care.  not sure why my feelings are the new goal post but making it all the person and not the facts is par for the course here.

 but i thought i made clear before i cared because robbie is being accused of cheating.  i dont care the score isnt listed, i care about the reasoning being given.  Once all this focus on the person and not the score is invovled, well guess what, i'm not the one making it about people, jeremys comment and you guys follow up make it about the people, and you better believe i care about robbie.  and between questing why do i care, as well as all the focus on how mean and rude robbie is, this was never about the score this was always about robbie, so as long as its made to be all about robbie and not about robbies score, then yes i care.  once it actually becomes about the score and not the person i'll stop caring.

This isnt the first time robbie was accused of cheating either.  I believe it was his 1260 score dwayne was saying robbie cheaeted on? if it was a different score thats not the point, the point is accusations of robbie cheating are nothing new. Heck he didnt even submit the score at first (and a practice game cant be cheating you can outright use save states in practice so cheating accusations make zero sense there), he only finally submitted to give his detractors a chance to dispute it and instead they smartly shut up.  People have been trying to get robbie on cheating for a while, and failing, and now seem to think this is the golden ticket to hold onto. 

does it all make sense now why i might care?
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Offline ersatz_cats

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #159 on: June 21, 2021, 09:54:46 am »
finally i'm loving the "why do you care" angle.  yeah, how many people complained about todds scores played any of the games he played?  Dragster was one of the worst games ever, if any of you did play it, i'd wager it was only because of the dispute and most people wouldnt even know dragster existed if not for todd.  First its about if robbie cheated, then its about if he thought he cheated, then its about if what he thought was true and didnt think is cheating would you view it as cheating if he was right, now its about why do i care.  not sure why my feelings are the new goal post but making it all the person and not the facts is par for the course here.

but i thought i made clear before i cared because robbie is being accused of cheating.  i dont care the score isnt listed, i care about the reasoning being given.  Once all this focus on the person and not the score is invovled, well guess what, i'm not the one making it about people, jeremys comment and you guys follow up make it about the people, and you better believe i care about robbie.  and between questing why do i care, as well as all the focus on how mean and rude robbie is, this was never about the score this was always about robbie, so as long as its made to be all about robbie and not about robbies score, then yes i care.  once it actually becomes about the score and not the person i'll stop caring.

Don't tire yourself out, putting up all those goalposts everywhere.

The actual circumstances have been beaten to death, but basically, lowering voltages (and using shit like hair dryers) should either have zero effect, or be wildly obvious. I'm not sure if this entirely rules out the momentary bit flip, say in a current score, which could go unnoticed over the course of the game. I'll leave that to the experts.

The point is the expressed desire to cheat. That's not DKF's word. That's Robbie's word. "Cheating", "manipulating hardware", "modified hardware", etc. I'm more than happy to quote those yet again, if you've forgotten. Just give me the word. If you can't see why that would be a viable grounds for disqualification, then you're just not looking at this objectively. (And no, that's not making it "about you", the person. It's just highlighting your poor arguments, which you don't seem to have thought through.)

To be clear, any score is inseparable from the person who claims it. Here, I'll give you an example:

"I just found in an old newspaper, someone scored one million on Donkey Kong in 1985!"

"Woah, that's cool! Who was it?"

"Todd Rogers."

"Oh..... Never mind, then."

Otherwise, you're left with a situation where you can only remove specific scores/times proven to have been cheated, which means a cheater can exhaust a moderation team with endless bogus submissions, on the hopes that some of them will not be able to be proven cheated. Again, this isn't even that complicated. There's a reason TG isn't going to be accepting any new submissions from Billy, Todd, Rodrigo Lopes, etc. Moral of the story: Don't cheat, and don't make a big deal out of the fact that you're attempting to cheat, even if you also think you can argue that you technically aren't.

Robbie has only one person to blame for all of this. His name is Robbie Lakeman. If you care about Robbie and want to help him, talk to him. You're not helping him by enabling his "I'm the victim" complex.
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Offline Snowflake

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #160 on: June 21, 2021, 12:20:01 pm »
i'm only bouncing between the goalposts that others keep putting up.  Kinda weird to complain about me humoring the bad logic and going with each ridiculous goal posts others raise.

as for the analogy to todd the major difference there is catching him cheating, versus and out of context snipped facebook posts talkingabout the desire to cheat using a method that noone considers cheating and not even in reference to the submission in question. world of difference.  I've already provided examples of where people think they're getting an unfair advantage (praying before sports, good luck charms at casinos) where as long as the organizers dont think it makes a difference then its no reason to DQ.  thats not even remotely close to someone who actually does cheat, is caught, and leaves us with the question if they did it elsewhere and not caught yet.

to flip your own words on you, if you cant see that simultaneoulsy claiming a score is valid while also DQing it then you are not looking at things objectively.  I would agree by the way that your logic here isnt making it about the person per say by slipping in the claim i'm (or turned around on you, you) am not objective but i would call it along the lines of weasel words where you just declare something correct without explaining it and even worse declare those who disagree lack objectivity despite no good reason being given to agree when full context is given and not just a few out of context quotes.  I would absolutely love people to objectively discuss this actual point since that was the original reason for reject as well as the reason we keep coming back to when all the other moving goal posts keep getting knocked down.

i wouldnt call Robbie a victim per se, thats a strong word, but for lack of a better word, and the point your making then actually yes, robbie is the one getting shafted here.  Everyone is to blame for their own actions.  Robbie is to be blamed/credited for his performance.  Jermy and only jeremy is to blamed for the reject, not robbie, jeremy.  And you and I are responsibile for all our comments.  Unless robbie has some secret admin access here, then hes not responsible for any decision made here, sorry it just doesnt work that way.  I will absolutely encourage/"enable"/commiserate/sympathize or any other word that may be appropriate with robbie on this one.  Until the people here, who i know have the abiltiy to luanch TG disputes because they've done so before, launch a tg dispute against robbie then i'll know that they know the score is valid.

This will be fun

Every score i have is cheated, and every future score i get i intend to cheat

note: the above is not true, i'm just curious if i'll see a carefully cropped screenshot of this comes up in the future.
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Offline Scoundrl

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #161 on: June 21, 2021, 02:50:38 pm »
The chicks read thru this thread yesterday and I caught it on camera!
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Offline Fly

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #162 on: June 21, 2021, 03:21:01 pm »
The chicks read thru this thread yesterday and I caught it on camera!

Subscribed!

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Offline datagod

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #163 on: June 21, 2021, 05:48:59 pm »
The chicks read thru this thread yesterday and I caught it on camera!

Accepted, even though I was expecting chicks as in broads.
Lets be pals!
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Offline bensweeneyonbass

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Re: Robbie's 1.272
« Reply #164 on: June 22, 2021, 11:44:15 am »
I say accept the score. I have a hard time convincing myself, in this particular case, that an attempt to cheat is either tantamount to cheating or grounds for a DQ despite the outcome of that attempt. I think the outcome is important, and the attempt to cheat is as well, but ultimately the outcome is what I think holds more weight because the attempt to cheat is arguably impotent. We have the video evidence and the context of the performance. If something were to arise that made the attempt to cheat more important, then the score can be pulled. At this point I think the performance outcome is the most important thing to adjudicate, and that outcome does not appear to be manipulated by the attempt to cheat.

Is this some bullshit? Yes absolutely and I wish Robbie would knock this shit off pronto. But here I am saying to accept his performance because what he's doing isn't just bullshit it's pointless and ineffective. Ineffective on the outcome of the game and ineffective in putting egg on anyone's face except his own.
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