Calling KO1'ers

[LMDAVE]

I agree if you bring in a sample of about 1000 more DK player (not just random people, but gamer who have the mindset to passion to play DK and learn it) that eventually half, if not more, will killscreen. 20% will break a million, 5-10% will break 1.1M, and maybe 1% will get 1.2M.

But the trick is sticking to it and wanting it. That's how all the people who have killscreened, got 1 mill, top 10, got there.

I read this morning on facebook about JCB having an article written about his recent killscreen and how he never gave up. I think it's great he achieved the killscreen, but that was also the mentality of the other 50-60 people who already killscreened. They all kept going until they finally got it (and the others that kept going for 1M, then top 10, etc)  and most of us are still going to achieve even higher.

That brings  us back to the original topic...maybe MOST aren't still going any more, that's why I called out that first sample of KO1 players, it seems that interest may be finally dieing out.

[up2ng]

Tbh, Jeff Willms could actually get 1.2m relatively quickly if he worked at it.

Maybe so, but that last 6,800 points could be REALLY tough to find!  ;-)


Hehe, seriously though, good topic.  It's good to see what everyone's thoughts are with respect to their plans for this game.

As for me, I'm pretty much done making a serious effort to improve my skills and my score on this game for now.  I'll still occasionally play a game here and there just for fun since it is still one of my all time favorite classic arcade games.  I'll try to make an effort to participate in the competitions -- I completely missed the last online tournament which featured some decent prize money and bounty opportunities.  I hope to do a better job of carving out a little time to play in future online tournaments -- MAJOR kudos to the guys who are organizing those and are putting up their own hard earned cash to keep those competitions interesting.  If live DK competitions and tournaments continue to happen in locations that are favorable to me such as Funspot or New Jersey (driving distance), I will continue to make an effort to attend those as well.

At this time, I continue to choose to avoid pursuing owning my own machine for many personal reasons although I think it would be cool to own one eventually later in life if they still exist.  Because of that, and the relatively difficult amount of effort that it would require to get myself in front of a machine, I won't be pursuing the arcade record in any serious or sustained way.  As opportunities present themselves once or twice a year I'll take my shot, but as we all know that is not enough time to adequately adjust to the platform or to luck into a favorable game.

If bounties start becoming substantial, it will be interesting to see how the community responds.  It would be cool if there were some serious threats to my score, but like Hank, at this point I would sort of like to see my score broken by another player before making more serious attempts and if there was a bounty on my own MAME score I think it would be sort of silly for me to be the one to go after it -- in a sense I would probably disqualify myself from pursuing such a bounty in the spirit of competition.  However, I know that if the money became serious, there are extremely talented classic gamers like Ben Falls or Steve Wagner who might "all of a sudden" become excellent DK players (they are already great players, but you know what I mean) and challenge these scores, so I do hope to see those bounties grow.

At this point, if I do continue to spend spare time on this hobby, I'd like to get more involved in sharing knowledge about the game through more forum posts and blog updates, perhaps contributing to Mitch's future "Expert" manual or creating one of my own.  I haven't seen a whole lot of strategy talk on the forums lately so maybe it's up to me to get some of that going again.

To all of the players and contributors, keep up the great work and keep having fun with the game!

[tudose]

great topic. very interesting to read everyones opinions and current dk status. love it!

i do disagree with a few things mentioned about bringing players from top-tier games and having them reach 1.2m in a short period of time. thats pretty much saying that our group of players are less skilled, have less natural ability, and that the reason we choose to play dk/cag titles is because we are not good enough and/or intimidated by the competition on those popular titles(which is total nonsense of course). we have some of the smartest, most capable, fastest learning, insanely talented players in the world competing on CAG titles. thats just what we prefer to play and has nothing to do with avoiding games like sc2 based on tough competition. besides, those competitive games are not like dk. theyre not random to the point of feeling cheated. and lets be honest those dudes wouldnt just fire up dk and grind for a year without making any money. the reason a lot of them(maybe not all of them, but the majority im sure) are so good is that they have a paycheck to look forward to on top of actually enjoying the game theyre playing. they have a reason to play outside of actually playing the game if that makes sense. the reason why deans score is so impressive(not only deans but a lot of the top dk/CAG scores) is that they were achieved by people that simply loved the games/competition/rivalries/new pb's etc.

ross hit the nail on the head when he said you can be totally capable of 1.2m and never reach it based on rng. ive watched dean play plenty of games where he made little to no errors and yet his pace fell below 1.2m simply based on unlucky pie factories/rivets.

Neither Hank or Dean stopped playing after they claimed the world record.  Both upped their mark many times over, and that's because they wanted to push the game, and themselves, purely for the challenge.  To score 1.2, one not only has to be really fucking good, but also obsessed to the point where their desire trumps their frustration.

this reminded me of a session dean played last year. you(ross) and i were both watching him restart over and over again. it went on for like 5hrs without a start. i remember you saying something like "ok dean i think its time to give it a break, man" as dean had pretty much gone silent with frustration. in fact i dont even think he responded to the comment. he just kept playing. he wasnt going to let that session end until he was satisfied. a few games later he took one to around 700k at 1.2m pace. it was one of the best games id ever watched. its almost like he knew it was coming and just kept plugging away until it happened. thats just one example of a players desire trumping his/her frustration and thats why dean has 1.2m+. that and hes also pretty good at the game

[marinomitch13]

At this point, if I do continue to spend spare time on this hobby, I'd like to get more involved in sharing knowledge about the game through more forum posts and blog updates, perhaps contributing to Mitch's future "Expert" manual or creating one of my own.

That'd be great, Dean! As of right now, I'm giving the manual a rest and then (probably this summer) I will eventually do the last finishing up of the (Beginner's" manual (mainly adding picture, but also cleaning up some sections' grammar/setup). I may not start serious work on actually typing up the "Expert's" manual until next summer (of 2015), but I'll probably start slowly working on a fairly comprehensive outline until then. If you have any ideas, or if you wanna start working on certain topics (or even propose a general outline), feel free to PM me and we can collaborate. As of right now, the main issue is motivation. It helps to have several people working on something like this to make it less work per person and to draw off of each person's "bursts" of motivation. Also, tbh, I feel like the "Expert's" manual is almost gonna be like 4x harder to do, as it will be comprehensive. Because of this, I'll probably try to use the beginner's manual as a sort of skeleton to build off of.

Also, if there are any other people that would like to contribute to this idea (whether it is just providing your writing/editing/graphics skill or contributing DK knowledge/content), PM me up.

[mikegmi2]

Just like we will probably never see a SC2 or LoL player make a serious run at 1.2, 1.1, or even 1M...the same probably holds true for any DK player making a run at the pro ranked scene of SC2 or League of Legends.

I would love to see (actually it would be awesome if anyone wanted to play some LoL) if anyone here could/would play an LoL account up to Level 30 (takes around 2 months with moderate play, must make it to L30 before allowed to play ranked games), start out in Bronze ranked, and make it into Silver (considered above average ranked player) or a higher tier of League of Legends (Bronze 5 is the lowest, then goes Silver 1-5, Gold 1-5, Platinum 1-5, Diamond 1-5, and finally Challenger is the highest you can get).

I've put maybe a little less, but very close to the same amount of time/effort into League of Legends as I have for DK, and I currently sit in Silver 4 division of the ranked ladder (barely above average).  Here is a chart that explains the LoL tier player distribution numbers, I think from last year's season (C is the Challenger League, the absolute top):

http://i.imgur.com/Bqln4yy.png

The interesting thing is, if DK has the RNG, the League of Legends equivalent would be "trolls".  Being ranked games (solo queue) must be played with 5 random players, you often find yourself with a troll on your team that plays really stupidly, rage quits, is AFK for the entire game, or just feeds the enemy team kills...making it essentially impossible to win that particular ranked game. Very similar to a rivet or PF screen "trolling" you, killing off all your men.

You can play well, be a team player, do all the right things...yet still go several games in a row without a win...pushing you further down the ranked ladder.  Just like you can go several hours playing DK without a start, or making any progress at all.

In the end I can only speak from my experiences...if i've got a few KS's and a couple 1M games under my belt (maybe placing me somewhere in the middle of 'Diamond' tier of DK players...close to the top but not top tier), and can only muster Silver 4 in LoL (barely above the 50th %ile mark)...and I have put in the same amount of time/effort...does that mean I am just a crappy LoL player, maybe different people are better at different games, maybe I am a LoL troll myself...or is the competition and games like LoL/SC2 legitimately more difficult than DK?

[TheSunshineFund]

I know nothing of League of Legends, but from your description it sounds like you are essentially mostly reliant on your team and if your team is not up to snuff or has some players that are playing poorly on purpose, your career ranking suffers.  I assume maybe when you get to a certain level, you will get assigned better players and that doesn't happen as much?  CAGs can cheat every now and then (Crazy Climber, I'm looking at you), but you will never be penalized for playing too many bad games of a title in anticipation of a breakthrough or great game....and...... 

"You are always in control"   

Unless I'm playing collaborative Joust or Mario Bros, I only rely on myself for success.  They seem like dissimilar experiences to me.  Unless BEA shows up at my house and keeps hitting the jump button randomly during my games or something.

[danman123456]

mike - Its the same in Titanfall or COD or Halo or any matchmaking type team game. It really doesnt matter if your the #1 player on COD if you get on a scrub team you will lose period. That is why "good" players want to team up and be on the same team.

[mikegmi2]

Yea I agree with you guys.  I was trying to throw out some data and add to the discussion regarding, are DK players better gamers or more skilled than SC2 or LoL players. 

pwn - Yes, one of the hardest things to do in LoL is break out of the Bronze/Silver tiers, and make it to Gold and up...where there are less trolls and people that leave the game...

Over a span of a few hundred games...the argument is that if you yourself are a "good" player...you should and will climb the rankings...based on the fact that if you are on your team...that leaves 4 open spots for "bad players"...but on the opposing team, there are 5 open spots for bad players...and thus in the long run, there will be more trolls and bad players on the team you are playing.

Kinda like the RNG in DK.  Over the span of hundreds of hours of play, the RNG will give you that "easy game" of DK...and if you play properly, you will make to the KS, get 1M, or break the WR.

[konghusker]

I'm not a ko1'er, but I'm glad to hear how everyone is doing.  As for myself, I've really lost interest since ko3.  I've tried to get a fire back, but just can't.  I still want to play, but when I sit down to start, I stop after a few restarts.  I've gotten more involved in other things like playing with my kids, spending time with Jessi, restoring and buying a few more arcade machines.  Now I've gotten into pinball a little.  I'm trying to start up another business, and build an addition onto the house.  Life is too busy.  Before, I was always this busy, but the fire over-rode the busy life, and I made time to play, and put everything else to the side.  I now realize that's not good, especially when it comes to time with my kids.  I know I'm not done playing though.  Every time I've played since ko3, it's been at a pace of over 1.1 for the most part.  I still want to hit that goal.  I've taken this game a lot further than I ever thought I could.  I remember just starting to play it 3 years ago, and my buddy Dana joked how someday I'll hit a million, and break the record, and be in kong off.  I laughed at that notion of his, as at the time I was barely hitting 100k, but loved it.  Kong has made me many new friends that I want to remain in contact with.  I was very disappointed to have kong off move to NJ, although I understand the reasoning.  Nothing negative towards NJ, but it's a lot more cost efficient for me to go to Denver.  I don't fly, I'm a chicken, so it's a long drive now too.  Depending on Ko4 setup, I still want to go, but it will be more difficult now.  Mainly I want to see all of the people I have befriended, and enjoy spending time with.  Kong has provided me much more than ever expected, and I hope it continues to keep us all in touch throughout our lives.  This is a great hobby, game, and community. 

[marinomitch13]

I now realize that's not good, especially when it comes to time with my kids.

That's a very good thing to keep in perspective. A while back, a lot of the KO1ers reinforced to me that real life ought to come first before DK. That's a great principle to remember. Even when I was working on the manual, I made sure that I finished my necessary HW and studies first. It's not worth screwing up your real life over. And, besides, if you keep everything in its proper place, lots of good things will result from it. As you've already mentioned, DK has brought you lots of new friends and fun experiences. I think almost all of us can agree with this. DK, when played for the joy of making new friends and relationships has been a big plus in my own life. Even when I've played the game with simply a mind towards improving personal perseverance and self-control, I'd say the game has been a good tool towards cultivating virtue. However, whenever it has been played to become the best above all else, it has only turned into headaches, frustration, and wasted time (oh Kong...).

Sorry to hear about how the KO4 switching to NJ affects things for you. I hope you can still find a way to make it!

[lakeman421]

I don't fly, I'm a chicken, so it's a long drive now too.   

Just drink at the bar before the flight, always works for me 

[mikegmi2]

I'm not a ko1'er, but I'm glad to hear how everyone is doing.  As for myself, I've really lost interest since ko3.  I've tried to get a fire back, but just can't.  I still want to play, but when I sit down to start, I stop after a few restarts.  I've gotten more involved in other things like playing with my kids, spending time with Jessi, restoring and buying a few more arcade machines.  Now I've gotten into pinball a little.  I'm trying to start up another business, and build an addition onto the house.  Life is too busy.  Before, I was always this busy, but the fire over-rode the busy life, and I made time to play, and put everything else to the side.  I now realize that's not good, especially when it comes to time with my kids.  I know I'm not done playing though.  Every time I've played since ko3, it's been at a pace of over 1.1 for the most part.  I still want to hit that goal.  I've taken this game a lot further than I ever thought I could.  I remember just starting to play it 3 years ago, and my buddy Dana joked how someday I'll hit a million, and break the record, and be in kong off.  I laughed at that notion of his, as at the time I was barely hitting 100k, but loved it.  Kong has made me many new friends that I want to remain in contact with.  I was very disappointed to have kong off move to NJ, although I understand the reasoning.  Nothing negative towards NJ, but it's a lot more cost efficient for me to go to Denver.  I don't fly, I'm a chicken, so it's a long drive now too.  Depending on Ko4 setup, I still want to go, but it will be more difficult now.  Mainly I want to see all of the people I have befriended, and enjoy spending time with.  Kong has provided me much more than ever expected, and I hope it continues to keep us all in touch throughout our lives.  This is a great hobby, game, and community.

Great post Steve, and I hope you are able to make it out to NJ as well (take Robbie's advice and drink heavily before your flight  ).

I share a lot of these points with you.  It is tough to sit down and go for 1.1M.  I often quit after 15min of trying for a decent start.  There also seems to be fewer and fewer days where a 3-4 hour block of time is available to even attempt putting up a high score.

The more I think about the potential new format for the KO4, the more I like it.  I played around 17 hours of DK at the KO3 and barely got to hang out and talk with everyone.  Even if the KO4 is single elimination, and I get knocked out first thing, I would be fine with it because I would be able to relax and have fun...talk with other players and watch the matches.

I hope you make it out to NJ if you're able, best of luck to ya!

[Xermon54]

Pretty much the same thing happened with me, Steve. After my 1,135,900, I wanted to be done with Donkey Kong and move on to other priorities. Although my goal was to get the WR, I felt enough happy with 1,135,900.

For the first 4 years, my priority was definitely Donkey Kong for the most part (the amount of time playing/watching was definitely fking high!). But for the last months, I changed my priority.

However, now that I'm more set up with my family/job/apartment, there's no reason for me not to go back to DK. Donkey Kong, for me, is all about friendship, and I need to spend time with my friends (no homo)  .

For the past months, I've neglected my friends, and it's now time to get involved more in the community and try again for some Donkey Kong.

What I learned these past few months: It doesn't matter what I decide to do in my life, the whole Donkey Kong stuff will always be a priority in my life. It's because it's where all started for me.

And the main thing I will ever be proud of in my life is definitely what I accomplished with Donkey Kong. Not only because I invested so much time in accomplishing the goal I had with Donkey Kong, but also because my Donkey Kong journey is what started everything in my life (fk yer I had a fking retarded life before  )

Everybody can have kids, a house, a nice job, friends, etc. But only one person can have the dedication and skills to be the best at Donkey Kong. (Yeah that's pretty much Dean, lol). Bring it on, b*tch!

[NightRider]

I didn't go to the KO1, but I was around the DK scene at the time and was a kill screen player. DK wasn't my first rodeo in competitive gaming so it was not something that defined me as a gamer. It was just another game that I was interested in and tried my best at for a while because I had seen TKoK and wanted to see how I could do on what Billy called "the hardest game". I did pretty well on the game and felt like I was among the top players while I was actively playing. Even though I was near the top of the DK ladder, I decided to call it quits although I did so with great difficulty. This game is really hard to let go of. It didn't help that I was having a lot of problems in my life at the same time, but those are in the past now.

Now I'm married and have a 3 month old child. All I can say is that life is pretty good now. When we have family gatherings at my place, I fire up the arcade games so that people can play. I usually play DK for a few minutes, but then I let someone else play and go hang out with my guests.