Am I the best all around player of the 3 Donkey Kongs?

[Simpsons99]

Funny thing is i used to leave my Name on CAG Fourms all the time.

Mark A ..    Told me i had some kind of record going for awhile.

I can'nt do that anymore ..  After a couple of hours i have to close all pages ..   Or when i goto bed i have to close everything down!

This thread might very well get you to pie status Mitch.

I'm the first to unlock the pie, and lemme tell ya, it's pretty sweet up here on my throne.

Can you taste it?

Oh yeah, tough guy?

Have you checked out the "Statistics Center" page recently?

https://donkeykongforum.net/index.php?action=stats

Scroll down to the bottom, take a look at the "Most Time Online" rankings, and weep.

No one has more free time on their hands than me.  I'm absolutely crushing you guys!

Soon, I will rule this forum, then the world!  Mwahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!

Sorry, my "Boris Badenov" alter ego took over for a moment.  I should take a break from watching "Moose and Squirrel" on the Cartoon Network.

[Jonesy]

If I had to make a list (which is tough, since I know my knowledge is inaccurate on some people's scores and abilities) it would be more or less close to this:

DK GOD #0: Allen Staal (You love eet?!)
1. Mark Kiehl
2. Dean Saglio
3. George Riley
4. Ben Falls
5. Steve Wagner
6. Billy Mitchell
7. Steve Wiebe
8. Hank Chien
9. Ike Hall
10. Donald Hayes
11. George Leutz 
12. Brian Allen
13. Dwayne Richards

Hi guys, great thread!

As an outsider living in England looking in, this list is the list I would have put together. I see Donkey Kong & Junior being the two that significantly make the list and DK being the key. I will say this though, if I were Mark, I'd be looking over my shoulder as I think Mr Riley is on his way!

[homerwannabee]

OK, a third person has stated Mark Kiehl is the best at all 3 despite the fact he doesn't even play the 3rd game.


Then one question.  If he is the all around best, than come up with a competition where he would actually beat score wise in all 3 games.  How bout we make Donkey Kong 3 5 man so the scores are more compatible with each other.

Mark Kiehl would have 1.05 million in Donkey Kong, 1.328 million in DKJr, and lets be generous and give him a 200k score in 5 man.    That's a score of 2.428 million.

I would have a score of .457 million in Donkey Kong, 1.313 million in DKJr, and a 1.303 million score in Donkey Kong 3.   Hmm that score is 3.073 million

Well last time I checked    3.073 million>2.428 million

See the people who put Mark ahead of me on the 3 games are the fuzzy feeling type of people.  It just feels good to put him ahead of me.  They actually have no mathematical info that backs up their claims AT ALL, but they will still make him ahead of me because it just FEELS RIGHT.  This is America, and they really should have the right to their opinions even if it is not backed up by any fact whatsoever.

You see any way you slice the math.  I beat Mark Kiehl.  Any way you slice the competition I beat Mark.  In fact you really have to bend over backwards to find ways to make this competition so that Mark beats me.

You see to them being the all around best at all 3 really means "Being the all around best at Donkey Kong, and Donkey Kong Junior".

It's a complete joke to put him ahead of me.  Yeah, I said that.  He needs to at least play Donkey Kong 3 before you start crowning him the best at all 3 games.

[TheSunshineFund]

OK, a third person has stated Mark Kiehl is the best at all 3 despite the fact he doesn't even play the 3rd game.


Then one question.  If he is the all around best, than come up with a competition where he would actually beat score wise in all 3 games.  How bout we make Donkey Kong 3 5 man so the scores are more compatible with each other.

Mark Kiehl would have 1.05 million in Donkey Kong, 1.328 million in DKJr, and lets be generous and give him a 200k score in 5 man.    That's a score of 2.428 million.

I would have a score of .457 million in Donkey Kong, 1.313 million in DKJr, and a 1.303 million score in Donkey Kong 3.   Hmm that score is 3.073 million

Well last time I checked    3.073 million>2.428 million

See the people who put Mark ahead of me on the 3 games are the fuzzy feeling type of people.  It just feels good to put him ahead of me.  They actually have no mathematical info that backs up their claims AT ALL, but they will still make him ahead of me because it just FEELS RIGHT.  This is America, and they really should have the right to their opinions even if it is not backed up by any fact whatsoever.

You see any way you slice the math.  I beat Mark Kiehl.  Any way you slice the competition I beat Mark.  In fact you really have to bend over backwards to find ways to make this competition so that Mark beats me.

You see to them being the all around best at all 3 really means "Being the all around best at Donkey Kong, and Donkey Kong Junior".

It's a complete joke to put him ahead of me.  Yeah, I said that.  He needs to at least play Donkey Kong 3 before you start crowning him the best at all 3 games.

Significant weight is applied to the original DK game which I think seems reasonable given its far reaching popularity.  I would assume something like (DKx4, DKJ x2, DK3x1).

[homerwannabee]

And like I said you have to bend over backwards in order for a scenario for Mark to beat me.  And yeah, applying 4 times the point value to Donkey Kong would be in effect bending over backwards.  You might as well assign a million times the point value to Donkey Kong.  Both make about the same mathematical sense.

[TheSunshineFund]

And like I said you have to bend over backwards in order for a scenario for Mark to beat me.  And yeah, applying 4 times the point value to Donkey Kong would be in effect bending over backwards.  You might as well assign a million times the point value to Donkey Kong.  Both make about the same mathematical sense.

What if you assigned a weight based on # of submissions on a game across all the scoring sites or do you feel that all 3 should hold equal weight? 

[homerwannabee]

And like I said you have to bend over backwards in order for a scenario for Mark to beat me.  And yeah, applying 4 times the point value to Donkey Kong would be in effect bending over backwards.  You might as well assign a million times the point value to Donkey Kong.  Both make about the same mathematical sense.

What if you assigned a weight based on # of submissions on a game across all the scoring sites or do you feel that all 3 should hold equal weight?

It doesn't matter how many people submit for Donkey Kong.  That really should have no factor whatsoever.   If there was going to be a weight scale, here is how I would assign it.  Yes, Donkey Kong gets more weight, but only because the highest possible score is lower.

I would give Donkey Kong a multiplier of 1.2.  That should be more than enough because 1.2 times 1.12 million equals 1.344 million.  A higher score than the high for Donkey Kong Junior or Donkey Kong 3.

I would also lock in the Donkey Kong 3 score at 1.3 million.  So if someone gets 2 million on 5 man, it still only counts as 1.3 million because the scores would be more in line with the other two scores.

Fact is this.  Just because there is more competition for Donkey Kong doesn't change the all around best title.  All it does is make the all around best title less significant.

So saying something like your the all around best at the 3 Kongs is like saying you are the shortest NBA player.   Or that you get the best grades for a person with an IQ of 80.  Or that you have the most hair on your body for a completely bald man.

So yeah, the more competition for the other two games does not change the numbers.  All it does it make the statement less significant.   To say that I am the all around best at all 3 games is really not saying much.  Me having the second highest score in Donkey Kong Junior is more significant than me being the all around best at the 3 Donkey Kongs just to put things into perspective.

So the title of being the all around best at all 3 Kongs really isn't saying much given the lack of competition.  It just sounds cool.

[TheSunshineFund]

It doesn't matter how many people submit for Donkey Kong.  That really should have no factor whatsoever.   

If we assume that submissions are generally of strong quality and therefore also use overall rank on a title to avoid having to try to theoretically rationalize game scoring equality:

Quantity increase of submissions increases the difficulty of being ranked higher on a given game which weight a game with more quality submissons more heavily. 

[homerwannabee]

It doesn't matter how many people submit for Donkey Kong.  That really should have no factor whatsoever.   

If we assume that submissions are generally of strong quality and therefore also use overall rank on a title to avoid having to try to theoretically rationalize game scoring equality:

Quantity increase of submissions increases the difficulty of being ranked higher on a given game which weight a game with more quality submissons more heavily.

OK, well if you combine both tournament, and marathon submissions, MAME/Arcade I am 1st out of 50 submissions.

For Donkey Kong Junior Submissions I am 2nd out of about 100 submissions, and for Donkey Kong I am about 50th for about 200 submissions.   

So me
1st out of 50 for DK3
2nd out of 100 for DKJr.
50th out of 200 for DK

For Mark Kiehl
1st out of 100 for DKJr.
7th out of 200 for DK
50th out of 50 for DK3 (Since  he does not play the game)

So now let's make the positions equal to each other, and make them equivalent to DK3.

So for my ranking it would be 1st for DK3, 1st for DKJr(You cut the 2nd to 1st since there is twice as many submissions), 12.5 for DK(You divide by 4 since there is 4 times as many submissions)

For Mark it would be 0.5 for DKJr (Half of 1 is 0.5), 1.75 for DK (7 divided by 4 equals 1.75), 50 for DK3 (Since he has no score I know of).

So now we add the totals, and the lower total is the better one.

So for me, 1+1+12.5=14.5
So for Mark, 0.5+1.75+50=52.25

So even if we do it by ranking divided by submissions I still do pretty well.

Edit: if you look at what I did, I even did what Steve suggested.  Give the DK ranking 4 times the value, give the Donkey Kong Junior ranking 2 times the value, and give the Donkey Kong 3 ranking 1 times the value.

[TheSunshineFund]

DK:

122 aurcade
101 TG
89 MARP

312 Total

dk jr:

54 aurcade
53 TG
24 MARP

131 Total

dk3:

20 aurcade (med and easy)
15 (TG marathon)
2 (TGTS)
26 MARP

63 Total
 

[homerwannabee]

DK:

122 aurcade
101 TG
89 MARP

312 Total

dk jr:

54 aurcade
53 TG
24 MARP

131 Total

dk3:

20 aurcade (med and easy)
15 (TG marathon)
2 (TGTS)
26 MARP

63 Total

OK, sure whatever let's do it that way.  I am still in the top 25 percent when it comes to Donkey Kong total submissions.   So .25 times 312 equals   78th place for Donkey Kong.  OK let's work with this math as well.  So based on this we give Donkey Kong a dividing power of 4.95, and we give Donkey Kong Junior a dividing power of 2.08, and DK3 is divided by one, meaning it remains the same.

I am 78th place out of 312 for DK, 2nd place out of 131 for DKJr, and 1st out of 63 for DK3.
Mark checks in at 7th out of 312 for DK, and 1st place out of 131 for DKJr, and 63 out of 63 for DK3(Since he does not play DK3).

So now my adjusted rankings 
My Donkey Kong place is 78/4.95=15.75, My Donkey Kong Junior place is 2/2.08=0.96, and my Donkey Kong 3 place is 1/1=1

Mark's Donkey Kong place is 7/4.95=1.41, His Donkey Kong Junior place is 1/2.08=.48, and his Donkey Kong 3 place is 63/1=63

So for me it's  15.75+0.96+1= 17.71
For Mark it's  1.41+.48+63= 64.89

Again my ranking average lower than Mark's given this adjusted system as well.  You can play this math game all day long, and I win in almost every single one of them.

[TheSunshineFund]

I am 78th place out of 312 for DK, 2nd place out of 131 for DKJr, and 1st out of 63 for DK3.
Mark checks in at 7th out of 312 for DK, and 1st place out of 131 for DKJr, and 63 out of 63 for DK3(Since he does not play DK3).

A Winner is Marky D with no score on one of the titles!


Where's the unicorn pic?

[homerwannabee]

I am 78th place out of 312 for DK, 2nd place out of 131 for DKJr, and 1st out of 63 for DK3.
Mark checks in at 7th out of 312 for DK, and 1st place out of 131 for DKJr, and 63 out of 63 for DK3(Since he does not play DK3).

A Winner is Marky D with no score on one of the titles!


Where's the unicorn pic?

But by your own math you know that is not true.  Now that last sentence make me believe you finally are catching on to the whole situation.  The overall best player in all 3 Kongs is about as significant as a unicorn picture.  Bingo!

See I never said this was significant.  No the power of adding Donkey Kong into the mix does not make it significant, but the power of adding DK3 into the mix makes it not significant.  Again I totally agree, be dismissive.  Now that has a stronger backing.  Agreed 100 percent!

The title of being the best at all 3 is cool sounding, but it is extremely hollow when you examine it upon closer inspection.

Mark's 7th place Donkey Kong score is WAY more significant than being the all around best at the 3 titles, because there is more competition for it.  My 2nd place Donkey Kong Junior score is also more significant than all around best at the 3 titles.  Why? because there is more competition for it.

Math wise though I still am correct.  9 times out of 10 the math says I am the all around best at the 3 titles no matter how you crunch them.

[TheSunshineFund]

Math wise though I still am correct.  9 times out of 10 the math says I am the best at the 3 titles no matter how you crunch them.

I agree the thread is insignificant, however I'm still confused why you take a % after just looking at straight rank which takes into account any weight already since the quantity of submissions handles that aspect.

I went into all 3 scoring sites, found the top score on all 3 games you or Mark have achieved and I used that score in conjunction with total submissions across all sites.  Marky won by < 10.  What is the issue with that logic?

[TheSunshineFund]

I'm just trying to get to the pie status for my account.....