Author Topic: Calling KO1'ers  (Read 16294 times)

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Offline TheSunshineFund

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #15 on: March 27, 2014, 07:37:36 pm »


Rest assured if the guys on KT, SKT1, or CJ Entus started playing DK full-time at least one or two of them would break 1.2m within a year, if not sooner. 

There was a huge discussion about the switch of the Korean eSports Association (KeSPA) teams from SC1 to SC2 (even though they're the same franchise, the games are wildly different in how they're played).  A lot of start-up Korean teams were starting to capitalize on SC2 before KeSPA made the switch, and they did capitalize for about a year. Once KeSPA switched, after about 6 months their players began to dominate all leagues, foreign and abroad.

There was a time in Korea a few years ago where there were 8 non-KeSPA teams. Only one of those teams is left. The other seven could not compete with the strength of play that KeSPA brought to the scene, and most of them dissolved once the vast majority of prize money began going KeSPA's way.

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Offline ChrisP

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #16 on: March 27, 2014, 07:54:02 pm »
I made a post here that was too weakly-connected to the topic to justify itself here.

I moved it to my blog...
« Last Edit: March 28, 2014, 02:19:03 am by ChrisP »
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4 Quarters :-* - 800K Avg. Per Qtr. :o - No Restarts 8) - No Proof :'(

7/26/2013   Coin 35,946   710,800   18-1
7/28/2013   Coin 35,947   903,700   22-1
8/16/2013   Coin 35,948   694,100   17-6
8/17/2013   Coin 35,949   893,100   22-1

3,201,700: the $1 World Record?
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Offline f_symbols

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #17 on: March 27, 2014, 08:17:17 pm »
Wes, no offense, but you have no idea what 1.2 is.  There is no way, I don't care what game they play. You really should try to play at 1.15 pace, for a month or two, before you even attempt to comment on the skills required for 1.2; let alone the favorable randomness.  I had similar sentiments before sinking my teeth into this game (at one time I was 1/500,000+ players on another game); I'm so good at game "x" that Dk will be easy... and was totally convinced that the Dk scores were soft, well, they aren't. Comments like that severely discredit dean's accomplishment, and without actually putting in the effort, you will never know what 1.2 really is, because it's not just a number...
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Drunkguy89

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #18 on: March 27, 2014, 08:42:24 pm »
I totally agree and would even go further,
I don't think there is anyone on the planet that could achieve Deans current score in a year (who has not played DK) and I'd be massively impressed if anyone (All current DK players included) could do it this year alone regardless of platform.

I'm not even a Million point player but its my belief that Dean has shelved the over all DK score to the point where it just doesn't seem feasible for anyone *currently* to take it, and the scoreboard makes it pretty evident that as of now no one has come close/within range(?)
and I know I just overstepped my boundaries in saying that   ;D

I'm probably way off with my assessment and at the risk of sounding a little arrogant I would even go so far as to say that if a pot developed for beating that 1st place score I'd be happy to chip in as I honestly don't see it changing this year at least.

But If it does that person has my  Kreygasm 's and my money  BibleThump.


Offline xelnia

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #19 on: March 27, 2014, 09:21:25 pm »
For what it's worth, Dean has at least the top 5 scores ever recorded for DK. He might have even more, but these are the ones I'm aware of:

1,206,800 - 10/04/2013
1,186,700 - 09/04/2013
1,167,400 - 04/21/2012
1,153,000 - 04/03/2011
1,139,900 - 10/01/2013

I originally had a long paragraph typed up about the two sides of this argument, but really...come on...someone who has never played DK before is not beating Dean in a year.
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Offline ChrisP

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #20 on: March 27, 2014, 10:53:08 pm »
I love that DK has a simply ridiculous top score now that is very likely to never be beaten. This is  the type of score that Billy's 874K was made out to be in KoK, only it's the real deal in Dean's case. If a legitimate challenger ever comes along, it's going to be exciting to say the least!

A serious bounty, like $10K+, is worth thinking about, if for no other reason than to prove that it really IS that hard, and is not just sitting there like a marshmallow because only a couple hundred people actually play this game.

Increase the competition pool tenfold and yes, you'd get a whole lot more kill screens, millions, and even 1.1s.

1.2 though...
http://donkeykongblog.blogspot.com

4 Quarters :-* - 800K Avg. Per Qtr. :o - No Restarts 8) - No Proof :'(

7/26/2013   Coin 35,946   710,800   18-1
7/28/2013   Coin 35,947   903,700   22-1
8/16/2013   Coin 35,948   694,100   17-6
8/17/2013   Coin 35,949   893,100   22-1

3,201,700: the $1 World Record?
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Offline marinomitch13

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2014, 11:30:54 pm »
Tbh, Jeff Willms could actually get 1.2m relatively quickly if he worked at it. He's had several deep games at over 1.2m pace. I don't think it would be crazy to say that there would be other gamers out there who could reach the same level at DK in the way Jeff has. Jeff admitted that he played a TON of DK in his first month of the game (at least he made it sound like it was way more DK-playing in a month than I have ever personally done), so that was how he progressed so quickly. I'm sure if other determined gamers from LoL and other games did the same, they'd learn quickly as well -especially with all the easily accessible knowledge out there. I actually don't think it is unreasonable to say that a year of playing DK at "Jeff Willms pace" would allow someone to have a legitimate shot at 1.2m. The trick is just finding someone with that much free time and motivation for that long of a period of time. Most people get sidetracked with other gaming desires or just get too busy to maintain all the skills necessary to play at 1.2m pace.
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lakeman421

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #22 on: March 28, 2014, 12:10:22 am »
A serious bounty, like $10K+, is worth thinking about, if for no other reason than to prove that it really IS that hard, and is not just sitting there like a marshmallow because only a couple hundred people actually play this game.
Sounds like the perfect bounty to me  <Tim>

Offline VON

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #23 on: March 28, 2014, 12:49:43 am »
If you forced the top LoL, SC, and DOTA teams to stop playing their games and paid them well to play only DK for a year...Dean's MAME score would probably be broken multiple times.

Rest assured if the guys on KT, SKT1, or CJ Entus started playing DK full-time at least one or two of them would break 1.2m within a year, if not sooner. 

Rest assured, you are wrong.

As Ethan said:
You really should try to play at 1.15 pace, for a month or two, before you even attempt to comment on the skills required for 1.2; let alone the favorable randomness.

And here's why: 1.2 is only possible when DK is played at the highest level and the game itself is favorable with its randomness.  Even if you have all the necessary skills, and even if you play thousands of games, you cannot be guaranteed a 1.2 game.  For it to happen, your best game and the RNG have to align.  Furthermore, 1.2 is a near cap on scoring.  There is nothing new left to discover about DK, so a new player isn't going to find some easier path to 1.2 because there isn't one.

To put things in perspective: It took me somewhere between 4-6 weeks to get my first killscreen.  It took me probably another 6 months before I was even 1.05 capable.  There are simply too many nuances to point-pressing for a brand new player to reasonably expect to learn it all in a short amount of time.

Take Jeff Willms, for example.  He was able to score over a million in only a few months (I think?), but that was with the aid of watching other players stream, such as Dean.  Jeff continued to play for months and months after his first million, reaching for that illusive monster game, but never found it.  He, like many of us, was turned back when it was realized just how much effort would really have to be poured in, and, frankly, there were better, more rewarding things to do with that time.

I'm not satisfied with my DK high score, but I reached DK satiation long ago.  I will eventually return to full out point-pressing DK runs, but only after it again becomes fun to do so.

This is why Vincent is ok with leaving his high score just 2,700 points shy of Hank's record.  This is why everyone here is genuinely happy for someone when they achieve a new PB, because in truth, getting a high score in Donkey Kong has always been about defeating the machine, and those of us that have spent hundreds of hours grinding know just what a dirty bitch game it can be.

Neither Hank or Dean stopped playing after they claimed the world record.  Both upped their mark many times over, and that's because they wanted to push the game, and themselves, purely for the challenge.  To score 1.2, one not only has to be really fucking good, but also obsessed to the point where their desire trumps their frustration.

Offline Xermon54

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #24 on: March 28, 2014, 04:16:42 am »
Dean spent at least 1 year playing at 1.2m+ pace (and he played hours and hours per week) before getting it. And he played for 4 years before playing at 1.2m pace.

With all the current information on Donkey Kong, someone could possibly get 1.2m within a year from a 10k highscore to 1.2m. But without any motivation impact (like money), it's extremely unlikely for someone to ever do that.

Some world class players play like 15 hours per day on their game to be the best at it. But for Donkey Kong, 15 hours per day is not gonna happen because of the frustration, and how fking boring that would be.

I would say 10% of the current DK members have the skills to put it to 1.2m. But skills alone is nothing compared to the motivation required (and luck) to get 1.2m. Skills and motivation are two different world. I can have the skills to play at 1.2m, but for me the riskiness involved would be way too hard and I would only be able to get a 1.2m pace 10% of the time (and would most likely die before stage 10 because I'm not enough consistent in taking those extra risks). And I would be able to finish a game at 1.2m pace like 0.001% of the time... so, let's do the math: not gonna happen ;-)
« Last Edit: March 28, 2014, 04:18:23 am by Xermon54 »
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Offline stella_blue

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #25 on: March 28, 2014, 05:04:13 am »
I would say 10% of the current DK members have the skills to put it to 1.2m.

I think that's a generous estimate.  I'd place the number somewhere in the 1-2% range.

so, let's do the math

Yes, please do the math.  Hang on while I get a bowl of Chex Mix.  This should be good.   ;)

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Offline VON

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #26 on: March 28, 2014, 05:08:29 am »
if a pot developed for beating that 1st place score I'd be happy to chip in

It would be great if there was an ongoing bounty pot to beat Dean's score.  If there was, I would start making point-pressing runs immediately.

There is a growing bounty pot to beat Hank's score offered during the DKOpens, why can't there be a bounty on Dean's score?  And if I'm being perfectly honest, I do consider Dean's score to be the true world record - sorry Hank, nothin' but love for you buddy, I hope you know that.

Someone motivate me, and everyone else who has more or less shelved their 1.2 quest.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2014, 05:26:52 am by VON »
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Offline stella_blue

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #27 on: March 28, 2014, 05:33:35 am »
There is a growing bounty pot to beat Hank's score offered during the DKOpens, why can't there be a bounty on Dean's score?

There's no good reason why it can't happen, other than indifference.  If 50 members of this forum each contributed $10 every 6 months, the bounty would increase by $1,000 annually.  I'll even kick in $20 to cover for that inevitable someone, who likes the idea, but can't be bothered to participate.

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Offline marinomitch13

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #28 on: March 28, 2014, 05:48:48 am »
if a pot developed for beating that 1st place score I'd be happy to chip in
Someone motivate me, and everyone else who has more or less shelved their 1.2 quest.
There is a growing bounty pot to beat Hank's score offered during the DKOpens, why can't there be a bounty on Dean's score?
There's no good reason why it can't happen, other than indifference.  If 50 members of this forum each contributed $10 every 6 months, the bounty would increase by $1,000 annually.  I'll even kick in $20 to cover for that inevitable someone, who likes the idea, but can't be bothered to participate.

Let's do this: https://donkeykongforum.net/index.php?topic=835.0
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Offline mikegmi2

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Re: Calling KO1'ers
« Reply #29 on: March 28, 2014, 03:24:04 pm »
You force X amount of players capable of 1.2M pace, to play at 1.2M pace for Y number of hours, and it results in Z number of 1.2M games.

If Y = 1000, and X = 100, solve for Z.


Solution: Z = 100

Why will the above scenario never happen?  Because currently there is only 1 person on Earth that has put themselves through the equation above...and there will never be 100 people willing to do so.

It goes without saying that 1.2M is an amazing accomplishment.  I will never get close to that.

I do know that once you get to a certain skill level, and put in enough hours for a particular score...it is a fact that you will get there if you keep at it.  You just have to play at whatever your pace goal is, for enough hours, and it will happen.
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