Donkey Kong Forum
General Donkey Kong Discussion => The Kong Off => Topic started by: hchien on September 25, 2013, 06:30:47 pm
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I'll start:
Do Friday scores count? If Friday scores do count, how are machines going to be shared among the 20 players (top 12 + online 8)?
On Friday, how many machines will be available for the online 8/top 12 and how many machines will be used for the wildcard tournament?
How many WC players will advance from Friday's tournament?
Is the Oct 25 deadline a played, submitted or verified deadline?
I'll batch send the questions to the KO3 organizers and post responses here.
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The Online Cool Guys. 8)
I like it!
And good luck getting responses to these questions, Hank! Lord knows I've tried...
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Hank has the inside track. Seriously, lets get all these questions out there so we can move on to the fun part of this competition.
My question is.. will the hot chick on the skeeball tables be back!
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Good questions Hank,
Here are a few off the top of my head:
Is there any way to avoid having machine selection in the middle of Friday's Tournament?
If yes OR if no -- Last quarter drops on Friday need to be specified.
Will there be any restarts allowed for Wildcard players? (I recommend 10 minutes) On Friday? On Saturday? On Sunday? Allowing restarts will make for a better player experience AND for better scores -- giving the Wildcard players a more realistic chance of competing against the Top 12 for the prize money.
Will there be anything (officially or unofficially) going on on Wednesday or Thursday (or Monday)? Will all DK machines be on the floor and ready to play ahead of time? What about other games?
Is there any chance of expanding the current schedule? How about first quarter - last quarter ranges of: Friday 10:00AM - 8:00PM (followed by machine selection), Saturday 10:00AM - 10:00PM, Sunday 10:00AM - 6:00PM (followed by awards ceremony) ?
I'm sure we can come up with a few more questions . . .
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Shawn, I can answer this one. ANYONE off the street can compete in the wildcard tournament. That's the whole idea. So theoretically there could be a 100 people showing up that want to play. However I think the $20 entry fee is enough incentive to dissuade the very casual player from wanting to enter. This was the whole incentive of qualifying online (so you wouldn't have to share a machine with a horde of people). However, it will not be as bad as you think. By most people's estimates, there will be about 30 wildcard players. If you subtract the 8 online qualifiers who won't be playing on Friday, that makes ~22 people sharing 10 machines (I will confirm that there will be 10 available). That means you will be sharing the machine with about 1.2 people. I'm going to guess that the average game on Friday will last about 1/2 hour. There will be lots of 200-300K players and their average game is probably under 200K. So that means you'll only need to wait about 36 minutes for a game. That's not bad in my opinion. Enough people will be eliminated on Friday that you will probably only share the machine with 1 person on Saturday (again I have to confirm how many people advance from Friday). And on Sunday you get a dedicated machine.
EDIT: If you have any questions, please post them by tonight. I'm going to compile our collective questions/suggestions and send it out tonight/tomorrow morning.
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Will there be anything (officially or unofficially) going on on Wednesday or Thursday (or Monday)? Will all DK machines be on the floor and ready to play ahead of time? What about other games?
Reading through this, I realized I can at least partially answer this:
Unofficial events that I'm aware of (please add if you know of anything else):
-Denver mint (George, myself, Youmee, Jeremy, Katie) Thurs afternoon
-Burrito Off 2 (Mitch v Hank)
-Swear Off (George, Robbie, Jourdan) Who's refereeing again?
-Couples off (signed up I think are: Wiltshires, Dan/Kayla, me/Youmee, Vince/Alexandra)
I don't think times have been announced for the last 3 events.
I don't think machine preparation will be as big an issue this year vs. last. Last year they had to get 16 machines ready from scratch. This year it will only be an additional 6 or 7 machines (one was given to Jeff Willms). Also I encourage anyone (if you haven't done so already) watch the 1up staff getting the machines ready. It's a lot more work than you think! Richie nearly killed himself for KO1 getting 11/12 machines ready by himself.
As for other games, I believe the only other games that will be available are for WR attempts: http://www.twingalaxies.com/article/2431/14-separate-event-tournaments-announced-for-kong-off-3/. (http://www.twingalaxies.com/article/2431/14-separate-event-tournaments-announced-for-kong-off-3/.) There is not much space for anything else.
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Any swear off without Alan Staal is not a real swear off!
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Allen is going to ref the Swear-Off. If he competed it would be completely unfair.
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Arm-wrestling off (Mitch vs Ken, Ken vs others (?), Mitch vs others (?), Hank (both arms) vs Vince (one arm :P ))
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Hank (both arms) vs Vince (one arm :P ))
LOL. I think I'll need both legs.
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General questions
On Friday, how many machines will be available for the online 8/top 12 and how many machines will be used for the wildcard tournament?
There will be 10 machines dedicated to the WC tournament both Friday and Saturday
Is the Oct 25 deadline a played, submitted or verified deadline?
All scores must be SUBMITTED by 10/25/13 at 11:59 pm
In what order do the players get to select their machines on Friday?
It is based upon the top 12. No 1 picks first, No.2 picks second, etc.
Will all DK machines be on the floor and ready to play ahead of time?
It is our plan to have all DK machines in the bar and playable by 11/14
Is there any way to avoid having machine selection in the middle of Friday's Tournament?
No. It can't be changed. There will be 10 machines dedicated to the WC throughout the day except from 5-6 when all game play will cease for selection. The WC competitors need to keep in mind they still have 12 hours for game play on Friday. A one hour break will not significantly interrupt the amount of time available. It's one hour no matter how you look at it.
Can you post "last quarter drops" for Friday rather than time intervals? For reference, I believe the longest games on Friday will be 2 hours, but 1.5 hours is pretty safe.
Last quarter on Friday is at 10:30 pm. It now reflects that on the website. Is the next question, when is the last quarter drop before the break to select machines? I feel that coming..:)
Is there any chance of expanding the current schedule? How about first quarter - last quarter ranges of: Friday 10:00AM - 8:00PM (followed by machine selection), Saturday 10:00AM - 10:00PM, Sunday 10:00AM - 6:00PM (followed by awards ceremony) ?
The schedule is set based upon the time the location is available. It can not be extended.
Wildcard related questions
Apparently all WC related questions should be directed toward John, Eric and Chris. So I/we ask John, Eric and Chris:
How many WC players will advance from Friday's tournament?
Instead of having players assigned to a machine, can you create a queue of players for all machines and the first in line gets the next available machine? If we switch to this method, when will players be added back into the queue (when their current game finishes or keep the order of players the same throughout)?
Can WC players restart games this year? If so, what are the 'restart' rules?
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No. It can't won't be changed.
::)
It's one hour no matter how you look at it.[/i]
Wildcard players should be aware that under this schedule play will be halted for FAR more than 1 hour. Available play will be MUCH less than 12 hours. It is what it is I guess and that's a shame since easy solutions are available. As long as all Friday players are aware of this issue ahead of time, it should at least negatively impact all players "equally" (sort of).
Can you post "last quarter drops" for Friday rather than time intervals? For reference, I believe the longest games on Friday will be 2 hours, but 1.5 hours is pretty safe.
Last quarter on Friday is at 10:30 pm. It now reflects that on the website. Is the next question, when is the last quarter drop before the break to select machines? I feel that coming..:)
This is highly amusing. (Why isn't there an emoticon for the head and hand motion where something "flies right over" someone's head . . .)
It's great to get some answers and clarifications to some of those other questions though. Thanks Hank. Good stuff.
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(Why isn't there an emoticon for the head and hand motion where something "flies right over" someone's head . . .)
(http://www.actuarialoutpost.com/actuarial_discussion_forum/images/smilies/oyh.gif)
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What constitutes "submitted"?
Can we play a game on Oct. 25, burn it to DVD, put it in the mail the next day postmarked Oct. 26? Or does it have to be postmarked by Oct. 25, no later? Or by submitted, do they mean it has to have been shipped and in the hands of Stephen Boyer by Oct 25 to qualify as submitted?
Also, I don't know how anyone else would feel, but would the community like or dislike moving the deadline date for qualifying for top 12 to an earlier date...for future Kong Offs?
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Even if I am not 100% happy with the answers, I am so fkng thrilled to have answers!
While I share your "uh oh" approach to things Dean, I think Friday will be okay.
As for the WC questions, I assume that I was identified as an info source because I wrote the report on the wildcard division format, but I have no "power" per se in how things actually play out.
How many WC players will advance from Friday's tournament?
It's still eight! Those 8 advance to Saturday and meld with the 8 online qualifiers for a total of 16 Saturday wildcard players. Even though there are 10 WC machines, 8 is still the number. I would say it's too late to change that.
The real question is how many of those 16 advance to Sunday and get their own machines. The new Kong Off site says 10, which would make sense, since there are now 10 WC machines. So I will go to KO3 assuming that 10 wildcards get a dedicated machine Sunday. This is something to confirm with Eric/John.
Instead of having players assigned to a machine, can you create a queue of players for all machines and the first in line gets the next available machine? If we switch to this method, when will players be added back into the queue (when their current game finishes or keep the order of players the same throughout)?
As I understand it, the wildcard division is totally under the control of Eric and John, meaning that they, and not the Kong Off organizers, have final say in the logistics of machine-sharing. This also means that they would have the responsibility of assigning referee(s) to the task. The queue system is better in terms of tourney integrity, but also more labor-intensive.
Can WC players restart games this year? If so, what are the 'restart' rules?
I like the idea of a restart period for Friday and Saturday, under one condition: that it not be a hassle, or referee-intensive. To make that happen, what we would is a large-display timer on top of the machine, visible to everyone present, that the player himself starts when he steps up to the machine. We wouldn't need 10 timers (rarely/never would all 10 machines be in a restart window), but we would need enough to go around. 5 maybe? Timers would make the restart period self-policing, and you wouldn't need a human writing down start times and telling everyone when their time is up. As for the window, I'd say it should be no less than 5 minutes but certainly no more than 15. And if there's no restart period, I see that as fair as well, since perhaps that's something that should be left to the top 12 as a perk. We'll see what John and Eric think of this.
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It's still eight! Those 8 advance to Saturday and meld with the 8 online qualifiers for a total of 16 Saturday wildcard players. Even though there are 10 WC machines, 8 is still the number. I would say it's too late to change that.
If 8 advance from Friday to Sunday, that means 16 people will be sharing 10 machines. I don't think it makes sense to "share" a machine if there are fewer than 2 per machine. I'd rather see either:
- 12 WC advance from Friday to Sunday (so 20 people share 10 machines on Sat)
- top 14 getting dedicated machines (so there would be 16 people sharing 8 WC machines)
- top 12 + top 2 online qualifiers getting dedicated machines (again 16 WCs sharing 8 machines)
This would give either more people a chance to play again on Saturday or more good players getting dedicated machines.
I like the idea of a restart period for Friday and Saturday, under one condition: that it not be a hassle, or referee-intensive.
Agreed. It's not like the 1-up has dozens of employees they can devote to refereeing the restarts. That would be a waste of personnel in my opinion. The only way this would work is if it's peer refereed. There's also the potential for quarrels happening. "Hey you restarted at 10:01!" This is why they probably didn't allow restarts last year. It's simple and there's no potential for arguments. The other choice is to have it as a set # of restarts. Say you're allowed 2 restarts (3 games) max. If you go past say 3-1 (where lots of restarts happen), you must play it out or forfeit your attempt. Might be easier than managing stopwatches but it might not be fair if someone dies on 1-1 3 times in a row.
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What constitutes "submitted"?
I haven't submitted a score under the new TG, but it seems similar to the old TG where you have to submit online first. I'd say that would have to be done before midnight Oct 25 (say Mountain time) and then send the tape in within a reasonable amount of time (say the next day or 2). I don't think anyone would disqualify your top 12 score if you did that. If you happen to have a good game on Oct 25, then you should probably call someone at TG anyway to let them know you're submitting a top 12 score. I'd think it'd only be fair to whoever is getting bumped to 13 to get this info out ASAP. Anyone want to have a streaming party on Oct 25? We could all title our streams "DK Cramming" or "Last Chance Dance."
Also, I don't know how anyone else would feel, but would the community like or dislike moving the deadline date for qualifying for top 12 to an earlier date...for future Kong Offs?
Ask Ross Benziger this question :)
I think the deadline is set appropriately. 3 weeks is about the right time frame to set a deadline like this (since it's about the right amount of time needed to make travel arrangements). You're only thinking about it this way because you're on the bubble now. Next year you could be #13 (not picking on you but just saying hypothetically) and want those extra few days/weeks to try to qualify. I think it's the right time frame for the community as a whole, but yeah if I were you, I'd wish the deadline was yesterday.
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Correct me if I'm missing somethinng, but I don't see any particular reason why there has to be symmetry between active vs. sitting out players on the WC machines.
If it's 16 players on 8 machines, you have 8 playing and 8 sitting out. If it's 10 machines, you have 10 playing and 6 sitting out. There doesn't have to be a 1-to-1 correlation between active and out does there? Again, unless I'm missing something in your logic, what's wrong with 1.6 players per 1 machine? It would better-reward those players who survived the qualifying rounds by giving them more time, rather than adding more Friday players who don't have to put up nearly as big a score.
The online qualifiers are already having to hustle a lot more to secure the Saturday spot than the Friday qualifiers, simply by the nature of the player pool. By the time WCQ#3 is over, you might need 900K to qualify online, but at that point so many of the better players are gone that the lowest-scoring of the Friday live qualifiers might squeak into Saturday with 400K or less. If you increase the number of Friday players advancing to Saturday, you're exacerbating that disparity even more, and making qualifying online less of a "win." You're taking a cut out of the online qualifiers' machine time for the benefit of the live qualifiers, who didn't have to work as hard as the online qualifiers to get to play on Saturday.
As for the player queue and how best to physically handle it, we don't need a ref. I'm thinking we'd have like a whiteboard with the list of names, and every time it's your turn, you start by going to the whiteboard, erasing your name from the top and writing it on the bottom, then you go to your machine, leaving the "next up" player at the top of the list. Makes sense? It would be even easier with a magnetic board with magnets that you could just move into position.
And to let people know when they're "on deck", we could send them a text or whatever so that they can come back to the machine area and get ready.
Also Hank, a simple "3-2 rule" (once you're on 3-2, you can't abort) is a really, really good idea, and much simpler/easier to police than a timer. Maybe it could be 4-2, or even 4-4?
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Correct me if I'm missing somethinng, but I don't see any particular reason why there has to be symmetry between active vs. sitting out players on the WC machines.
No, there doesn't need to be symmetry between players and machines, but the way I look at it is: when I'm playing, I'm on break almost 50% of the time anyway. So if you have fewer than 2 players sharing 1 machine, I bet there are people who would want a longer break. Think: during the online qualifiers (when you had a dedicated machine) how many hours of the available time did you actually play? No one can play DK for that many hours without needing a break.
All I'm really saying is: that extra time could give more WC players an opportunity to play a 2nd day or could be given to a player as a dedicated machine. I think you've heard too many horror stories from the WC players last year when there were 4 or 5 per machine. Yeah I'd have PTSD too if I shared a machine with 4 players. 2 per machine is fine (especially 2 per machine with a queue system). In fact, one year at Funspot, Dean, Eric Howard and I were all sharing a machine and we were not fighting for the machine at all (and we were all playing seriously).
It's not really my decision, nor does it affect me this year (unless something catastrophic happens!), but that's just my opinion.
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While you were replying, I added a paragraph that you might have missed.
(To sum up: Increasing the number of Friday qualifiers is sort of unfair to the online qualifiers, because it further decreases the reward of qualifying online, which is significantly harder than qualifying live will be.)
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Just thought I'd jump back into this conversation for fun. :-)
(To sum up: Increasing the number of Friday qualifiers is sort of unfair to the online qualifiers, because it further decreases the reward of qualifying online, which is significantly harder than qualifying live will be.)
I'm not sure I get the logic with this.
First, the reason for the question was because when the number of players moving through to Saturday play was set at 8, the number of machines was also set at 8. The number of machines has now been increased to 10. So, bumping the number of Saturday WC players up to 20 would not really be increasing the ratio at all, it would be bringing it back in line with the original intent -- and the question came about because perhaps that was just an oversight. It seems reasonable to assume that the increase in the number of machines was meant as a way to handle a larger number of players.
Second, I don't really follow the argument about it being unfair to online qualifiers. Qualifying online is a major advantage as it eliminates the possibility of having to play on Friday where there could potentially be almost no time to play and if you happen to have 1 or 2 bad games your tournament could be over. Qualifying to play on Saturday guarantees that all players will have a decent amount of time and also ensures that they will be listed on the final scoreboard.
But, again, however you guys want to do it will be fine I'm sure.
Also Hank, a simple "3-2 rule" (once you're on 3-2, you can't abort) is a really, really good idea, and much simpler/easier to police than a timer. Maybe it could be 4-2, or even 4-4?
Well, unless this is combined with some sort of limit on the number of restarts, this is actually a pretty terrible idea. In the last 2 weeks alone I've had 3 different DK sessions of between 2 and 3 hours each where I never saw a pie factory. This can happen if you're playing like a maniac and it can also happen if you are a less skilled player.
So, who is going to referee an exact number of allowed restarts per attempt? To me, that's actually MORE of a headache for a ref than a timer for multiple reasons.
As for the player queue and how best to physically handle it, we don't need a ref. I'm thinking we'd have like a whiteboard with the list of names, and every time it's your turn, you start by going to the whiteboard, erasing your name from the top and writing it on the bottom, then you go to your machine, leaving the "next up" player at the top of the list. Makes sense?
Actually, in my opinion, this is the second best way to go, and it's a distant second. This lines up pretty closely with what Dan had suggested. In my opinion, it would be significantly better to be added to the bottom of the queue when your previous game ENDS.
I actually explained in detail how a ref would keep track of this queue WITH a 10 minute restart period in an extremely easy and straightforward manner. Did nobody read that post? Was it too long? lol
But again, if everyone wants to do it that way then that's how it will be I'm sure.
I just hope that however the tournament is run will cause the least amount of complaining, "bad tastes", and poor experiences for everyone who makes the trip. I'm already extraordinarily concerned about the Friday schedule and how that could potentially ruin the entire event for most people, but so far nobody else seems to care about what will happen (and I KNOW what will happen). If we manage to get through all of these details and everyone is still having a good time then that's a good measure of success.
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It would be even easier with a magnetic board with magnets that you could just move into position.
In my opinion, it would be significantly better to be added to the bottom of the queue when your previous game ENDS.
Just take your name magnet to your cab, and when you're done put it back on the board?
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What constitutes "submitted"?
Can we play a game on Oct. 25, burn it to DVD, put it in the mail the next day postmarked Oct. 26? Or does it have to be postmarked by Oct. 25, no later? Or by submitted, do they mean it has to have been shipped and in the hands of Stephen Boyer by Oct 25 to qualify as submitted?
Also, I don't know how anyone else would feel, but would the community like or dislike moving the deadline date for qualifying for top 12 to an earlier date...for future Kong Offs?
My guess is this. They said "Submitted, and not verified". I think an argument could be made that they mean submitted to the Twin Galaxies website. So I am thinking that you could get a score accomplished on Oct. 25. Submit the score to their website, and than mail it off the very next day on October 26th. I would definitely advise anyone to mail off their score the very next day if they submit on Oct. 25th. If you hold onto it for two weeks, and mail it off right before the competition, don't be surprised if you don't qualify.
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Well, unless this is combined with some sort of limit on the number of restarts, this is actually a pretty terrible idea.
My original idea was to have 2 restarts max (3 games max). This would actually be a lot easier to ref. You could just put in 3 credits into the machine, lock the coin door, strip search everyone for quarters (only kidding... it's actually quite simple to disconnect the coin door wiring from the main board) and walk away. A lot easier than dealing with 5 stopwatches IMO. I only mentioned 3-1 as a point of no return. Chris was just emphasizing the part about having a point of no return. 3-1 is convenient because:
- a lot of "unavoidable" deaths happen there
- it takes maybe 5-6 minutes to get to 3-1 (running boards) and combined with 2 restarts max, that's a max of 12 minutes for restarting
In my opinion, L4 restarts shouldn't be allowed. L4 barrels are significantly easier than L3 barrels because of the steerability. Also even when playing for safety, I'll grab the bottom hammer on L4 to stall for 33 seconds. If you have a reasonable hammer by the time the hammer expires or shortly after, you should be clear of L3 type wild barrels. Also if we allow L4 restarts, now we're talking 15 mins PER restart-- theoretically 1/2 hour just to start a game. That would significantly increase wait times.
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Wow everyone is just jamming this thread love it :)
1. I think the once you reach 3-2 the no restart rule applies is perfect. At that point you have passed pretty much all the cheese wild barrel boards.
2. I think you get ONE restart period to keep the games flowing Friday/Saturday. If you get a cheap lvl 2 death you get to try again but otherwise that should be it. Plus that is very easy to peer police.
3. I understand what Dean is saying but I just feel that putting your name at the end of the list AFTER you play is penalizing "good" play. Someone starts after I do and ends before me then they will be on the list ahead of me to play again. All of this it likely wont make too much of a difference either way but I fail to understand as a player if I have an "ok" game that means I get skipped to someone who didn't in the process? That is what caused some angst last year. People qualified for day 2 on their FIFTH attempt while others only had 2 or 3 tries. I think the amount of times you get to start a game plays more in the chance of getting a big score versus if you have an ok game where you play for 30-45 minutes.
Dan
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I understand what Dean is saying but I just feel that putting your name at the end of the list AFTER you play is penalizing "good" play. Someone starts after I do and ends before me then they will be on the list ahead of me to play again. All of this it likely wont make too much of a difference either way but I fail to understand as a player if I have an "ok" game that means I get skipped to someone who didn't in the process? That is what caused some angst last year. People qualified for day 2 on their FIFTH attempt while others only had 2 or 3 tries. I think the amount of times you get to start a game plays more in the chance of getting a big score versus if you have an ok game where you play for 30-45 minutes.
This. Everyone should get closer to the same number of attempts as the priority -not time. WC players last year recognized that if someone had a good game, they earned the extra time they got. The real annoying thing was/would be if you just got off a great game and were in the zone, but you had to wait for several lower level players to get in their attempts when they are taking like attempt 6-7 and you are only on attempt 2.
I, however, am against restarts for the WC players. This is for the same reason as I've said before: WC players should be severely hindered so that the KOs remain, in a very significant way, about the top 12 players. Even 1 restart is not much different than the perks of the designated machines, since most KS players could get used to a machine in 1 restart's time as well as if they actually got a good game (like 1.5hrs+), many people would want to take a break afterwards anyway -just like top players will around 25% of their time, even though they have unlimited restarts.
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3. I understand what Dean is saying but I just feel that putting your name at the end of the list AFTER you play is penalizing "good" play.
I can make a strong argument for putting your name on the list AFTER your game ends:
- if you happen to have a long game, you're going to want to take a longer break anyway. In your system, if you have a long game (or even mediocre game) you could potentially be "up" again as soon as your game ends.
- By my estimates on Saturday (if there are 16 people on 10 machines), the wait time will only be 36 minutes (+5 min if restarts are allowed). So if your game lasts more than 36 (or 41) minutes (which is very likely for a lot of players) you'll be up again before your game is even finished. This is also another argument for why there should be 20 players for Sat.
- If you are a casual 100K player on Friday (many of whom are not on these forums and can't voice their opinion) and you pay the same $20 as everyone else to enter just for fun, your experience will be markedly diminished by your method. If you allow this player (whose games only take 10 minutes) to get a few more attempts in, his/her experience will improve a lot, with very little added wait time for the better players.
I want to make one (not so final) comment. I feel like a lot of the suggestions/opinions being thrown out are based on last year's experience or to benefit themselves. You have to keep in mind the broader picture. I actually think no matter what system is used this year the experience will be much better just based on the fact that the machine:player ratio will be much higher this year. Also the point of the wildcard machines is to get more players involved and to have fun. Yes it's a competition and yes a wildcard would win or place but that's not the main point IMO. If you do not want to get people involved, we should just make it the top 22. The new players are what's going to keep DK alive and the event successful. If you enter as a casual WC player on Friday and only get 2 or 3 10 minute games because those killscreeners are hogging the machine, you're not going to enter or even come to the event next year.
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What constitutes "submitted"?
I haven't submitted a score under the new TG, but it seems similar to the old TG where you have to submit online first. I'd say that would have to be done before midnight Oct 25 (say Mountain time) and then send the tape in within a reasonable amount of time (say the next day or 2). I don't think anyone would disqualify your top 12 score if you did that. If you happen to have a good game on Oct 25, then you should probably call someone at TG anyway to let them know you're submitting a top 12 score. I'd think it'd only be fair to whoever is getting bumped to 13 to get this info out ASAP. Anyone want to have a streaming party on Oct 25? We could all title our streams "DK Cramming" or "Last Chance Dance."
Also, I don't know how anyone else would feel, but would the community like or dislike moving the deadline date for qualifying for top 12 to an earlier date...for future Kong Offs?
Ask Ross Benziger this question :)
I think the deadline is set appropriately. 3 weeks is about the right time frame to set a deadline like this (since it's about the right amount of time needed to make travel arrangements). You're only thinking about it this way because you're on the bubble now. Next year you could be #13 (not picking on you but just saying hypothetically) and want those extra few days/weeks to try to qualify. I think it's the right time frame for the community as a whole, but yeah if I were you, I'd wish the deadline was yesterday.
Yea I wasn't bring up the point on any personal level, but just in general for planning/travel type purposes.
I know some have said they would or wouldn't go to the Kong Off depending on if they qualified for the top 12, or upped their personal best, or for other reasons that are based on putting up a score by the deadline.
The closer the deadline is to the event, the harder it is for an individual to plan accordingly.
The same type of craziness will happen if the deadline is 2 or 3 months before the event, but the planning and travel arrangement craziness would be all but removed from the equation. Especially considering the 3 month cheapest flight thing you pointed out Hank = )
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Oh yeah Hank I think we want to encourage people to play. When I play out the scenario it works out to be the same almost always. Going after you play of before you play. Unless we think 10 people will be playing for 1 hour+ that same situation applies doesn't it? With more machines and less chance of getting 5 on a box its going be much better playing experience overall. I just hate to see a scenario where someone got 10 chances and gets a KS on his last play and because you were doing 400k games you got 4 tries. It's an issue either way. :)
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After reading Dan's reply, I thought of another good argument for going back on the queue AFTER you finish. I mentioned this earlier... but suppose you are a killscreen player and you die 3 times before L6. Now most people on a dedicated machine in this situation would restart. However if you know your name is already on the queue and you will have to wait anyway, you might just play the game out. However, if your name is NOT on the queue, you might want to end your game earlier so you can get back on the queue earlier. In fact, I would say knowing your name is not on the queue and that the wait time is only 36 mins (for the 16:10 scenario) is enough incentive to end the game early. This actually BENEFITS EVERYONE. Not playing out dead-end game would lead to even faster turn around times for everyone.
And BTW 36 mins is not even enough time to eat lunch (unless your name is Mitchell Elliott). Vote for Pedro, I mean 20:10.
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If you don't have a big game, you can blame it on having to share a machine with players that aren't as good as you. But just have a big game and it won't be an issue.
Anyway, I'm liking this idea of punishing the online qualifiers. Let's work with that:)
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After reading Dan's reply, I thought of another good argument for going back on the queue AFTER you finish. I mentioned this earlier... but suppose you are a killscreen player and you die 3 times before L6. Now most people on a dedicated machine in this situation would restart. However if you know your name is already on the queue and you will have to wait anyway, you might just play the game out. However, if your name is NOT on the queue, you might want to end your game earlier so you can get back on the queue earlier. In fact, I would say knowing your name is not on the queue and that the wait time is only 36 mins (for the 16:10 scenario) is enough incentive to end the game early. This actually BENEFITS EVERYONE. Not playing out dead-end game would lead to even faster turn around times for everyone.
And BTW 36 mins is not even enough time to eat lunch (unless your name is Mitchell Elliott). Vote for Pedro, I mean 20:10.
Yeah unless everyone is having monster games the wait isn't going to be monumental and I'll be ok with whatever decision is made regardless because it works out better than a group of x players sharing a machine. Plus thats true would you try and sweat out a game where you are on your last man at lvl 5 or try and get back in to restart? I'm guessing what you said hank would apply and I would want to try again.
Also I was thinking would anyone have heartburn about saying you can let someone skip you and still maintain your place in "line" so to speak. If you just want to take a break I cant see anyone having a problem with that. Your name just remains at the top of the queue until your ready to play.
Crush those online qualifiers I think I'm out at this point anyway ;)
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My question is.. will the hot chick on the skeeball tables be back!
I got an official response to Ken's question:
we can't guarantee her but we are positive there will be other hot chicks!
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The top eight combined scorers of the Online Qualifiers will join the top eight scorers of the Live Qualifier to compete in the Wild Card Division Finals on Saturday November 16 in Denver. The top 10 scorers in the Wild Card Division Finals qualify for The Kong Off 3 and challenge for overall victory.
Will the Saturday scores count in the overall Kong Off scoreboard/rankings, or are the Saturday score just used for determining Sunday wildcard dedicated players, and your Sunday score is what goes against the top12?
So, if I get 1,020,000 on Saturday, I proably qualify for Sunday, and lets say Sunday I onky get 500K, is the 1,020,000 still counted?
The rules read as if only Sunday scores will go against Top 12 bKong Off 3?
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Yeah, I don't like that wording either. Great question though.
Unless the KO changed something, John and Eric's setup is that the only scores that don't count for the overall KO3 scoreboard are the Friday live qualifier scores. Starting Saturday, everybody's scores count. That was definitely their plan.
I assume the site just has that mis-worded, because really, if Saturday scores DIDN'T count, it would be kinda ridiculous. One day (the short day), to put up a score?! How much "qualifying" do we have to do?
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Will the Saturday scores count in the overall Kong Off scoreboard/rankings, or are the Saturday score just used for determining Sunday wildcard dedicated players, and your Sunday score is what goes against the top12?
Saturday scores count for the overall tournament for everyone (wildcard + top 12). It's only the Friday scores that don't count-- they only count for qualifying to Saturday. But I do agree the wording is a little imprecise.
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Hey everyone! Here are a few clarifications, hope this helps:
- We now have 10 machines dedicated to the wildcard players!
- As such, we are now taking the top 10 online qualifiers (used to be top 8 ) for automatically playing on Saturday (these players do not need to play on Friday).
- On Friday, we will take the top 10 players and those players will join the top 10 online qualifiers for Saturday's game play (for a total of 20 players on 10 machines; players will take turns on these machines).
- If we have less than 10 players on Friday (this is certainly possible but not likely), there will be no need for Friday's qualifier.
- The top 10 players from Saturday will go on and play on Sunday on their own dedicated wildcard machines.
- The scores from Friday do not count on the official KO scoreboard (however all scores from Saturday and Sunday do count on the KO scoreboard).
- There is a $20 entry fee for all wildcard players. All of this money will go back to the wildcard players; we will pay out 1st, 2nd and 3rd place.
- Good luck !!!
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As such, we are now taking the top 10 online qualifiers (used to be top 8) for automatically playing on Saturday (these players do not need to play on Friday).
I'm pleased that 9 more qualifiers have been added, instead of just that one guy with the round, yellow head and sunglasses.
Just kidding, Eric. You're not the first forum member to be victimized by the "accidental smiley".
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LOL oh crap, totally missed that :)
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If you just so happen to find another machine laying around, I think you should give it to the guy in 13th ;)