Author Topic: Dean's DK Blog  (Read 41220 times)

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Offline Josephjo

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #45 on: July 20, 2013, 11:24:36 pm »
I tuned it from LV 12 onwards that last man was probably the best I've seen Dean play. To score so highly and yet make it look so effortless is an amazing skill. I was gutted when that wild barrel finally got him as I thought he was going to the end.

Good luck on your next run.
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Offline stella_blue

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #46 on: July 21, 2013, 08:16:33 pm »
Sorry Scott, I don't normally save inps for that sort of game.  It had already been overwritten by the time I saw that you had asked for it.  Hopefully it's still in the Twitch archive!

No worries, Dean.  I was able to watch the entire game before Twitch deleted the video.

The game summary has been compiled and posted:

DK Data Library of Memorable Games

DK High Score 
1,064,500
  (L22-1)
DK Level 1-1 
13,400
DK No Hammer 
535,300
  (L15-2)
Member for 11 Years Most Time Online DK 1M Point Scorer DK Killscreener Blogger Twitch Streamer

Offline VON

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #47 on: July 24, 2013, 09:09:00 pm »
Hey Dean, I see that you're still having problems with your Twitch chat.  I recently had issues getting my Twitch chat to load as well, but I was able to completely resolve the issue by clearing my cache. 

I know you like to frequent disreputable porn sites that may be leaving tracking-cookie crumbs, so before you fire up your next Twitch session, try clearing your cache.

If clearing your cache does no good, then, if you want, you can give me a report of the problems and I can try and help get you all better.

Offline up2ng

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #48 on: August 04, 2013, 11:39:54 am »
I've decided that I'm going to make some changes to my approach to the first three screens of the game.  The idea is to try to drastically improve my success rate of reaching the first elevator screen while not giving a whole lot away in terms of points.  My sessions over the past few months have become borderline useless because I just cannot get through the first three screens of the game.  My success rate is currently likely to be WAY below 5% -- this just destroys sessions, especially when I try to squeeze in a game in a limited window of time.

I'd really like to get to the point where my success rate is over 25%.  Setting aside AT LEAST half of the failures for unacceptable Level 1 rivet screens (average or below average randomness), this would require Herculean improvement on the barrel screens, ESPECIALLY 2-1 since the time screw is so much more severe when restarting on 2-1 than it is when restarting on 1-1.  Getting anywhere near a 25% success rate is probably very unrealistic, but it's a good goal to keep in mind during this phase of each session.

For quite some time, I've defined my minimum benchmarks as follows:

1-1:  9,500 minimum (restart any score below this threshold)
1-2:  18,000 minimum (restart any score below this threshold)
         20,000 "good score" minimum (for scores at or above this threshold, adjust my 2-1 strategy to play much safer, in an attempt to protect a good Level 1 score and move on with the game with a decent score.
2-1:  No minimum threshold -- but play strategy ranges from "moderately aggressive" to "very aggressive" based on the Level 1 score.

This approach generally yields scores in the 29,500 - 32,500 range, with some outliers above or below this range.

The problem is, as my game has improved, I had been sliding further and further away from the "moderately aggressive" strategy on 2-1, regardless of my score.  So, even when getting 22,000+ points on Level 1, for example, I would often tend to "go for it" and stay with the "very aggressive" strategy in an attempt to get a rare huge score going on these screens.  So, my scoring range after 2-1 was actually climbing even higher.  However, even though my skill has improved, this gradual change in mindset has severely hampered a large percentage of sessions, and many many sessions lately end without ever getting a game started.  Even though I agree strongly with the concept of playing extra aggressively on early screens in order to try for big starts where the time tradeoff for restarting the game is relatively low, having lots of sessions run this bad means that things are clearly out of balance and the gains are no longer worth the time.

I'm now going to make some changes to my benchmarks and strategies in order to front load the risk a bit more and to hopefully improve my overall success rate, while hopefully giving up only a small amount of points.

My new benchmarks will be as follows:

1-1:  10,000 minimum (restart any score below this threshold)
1-2:  18,500 minimum (restart any score below this threshold)
         20,500 "good score" minimum (for scores at or above this threshold, adjust my 2-1 strategy to play much safer, in an attempt to protect a good Level 1 score and move on with the game with a decent score.
2-1:  No minimum threshold -- but play strategy ranges from "moderately aggressive" to "very aggressive" based on the Level 1 score.

The main difference here is that I will force myself to go back to using a safer strategy for any scores above my Level 1 "good score" minimum and that should lead to MUCH fewer 2-1 restarts and should bump up my overall success rate significantly.  There will likely be a small drop in my average 2-1 score as a result, and I will never get the really big 2-1 scores with this strategy, but hopefully I'm giving up less than 1000 points with this change and I'll have much more productive sessions.

We'll see.
Donkey Kong:  1,206,800  Kill Screen
Donkey Kong:  898,600     16-5
D2K:                 380,200     L=9
Donkey Kong Junior:  In Progress
Member for 11 Years DK 1.2M Point Scorer Winner of a community event Wildcard Rematch Champion Blogger Former DK Level 1-1 World Record Holder Former DK No-Hammer World Record Holder DK 1.1M Point Scorer DK 1M Point Scorer DK Killscreener Former DK World Record Holder - MAME Individual Board Record Holder Twitch Streamer

Offline stella_blue

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #49 on: August 04, 2013, 02:18:17 pm »
Have you considered doing away with the Level 1-1 minimum requirement altogether, and evaluating your score upon completion of L01 instead?  Sure, rivet screwings are a fact of life, and can quickly negate a strong barrel board.  But it's also not that uncommon for a favorable rivet stage to bail out a weak 1-1 score.  You'd only need 10k on the rivets to bring an 8500 on 1-1 back to the "acceptable" level.  Maybe, just maybe, you'll salvage more starts than you anticipate.

Just offering a different point of view.

DK High Score 
1,064,500
  (L22-1)
DK Level 1-1 
13,400
DK No Hammer 
535,300
  (L15-2)
Member for 11 Years Most Time Online DK 1M Point Scorer DK Killscreener Blogger Twitch Streamer

Offline tudose

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #50 on: August 06, 2013, 08:29:06 am »
we see you on twitch checking out DKF. if youre that bored then play some stocker!
Member for 11 Years Former CK World Record Holder - MAME DKJR World Record Holder - MAME DK Masters - Rank D DKJR Killscreener DK 1.1M Point Scorer IGBY 2016 DKF Team Member IGBY 2015 DKF Team Member Blogger Winner of a community event DK 1M Point Scorer DK Killscreener CK Killscreener Twitch Streamer Former DK Level 1-1 World Record Holder

Offline Bliss1083

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #51 on: August 09, 2013, 01:56:36 pm »
I'm with Stella a 9k 1-1 can turn into 19k after level 1. You don't lose much for trying.
Donkey kong  arcade 867,000 kill screen
Donkey kong arcade 1-1 12,800 12,200 12,100 and 12,000
Donkey kong end of level 4 132k
working on my hello kitty island adventure skills
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Offline f_symbols

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #52 on: August 12, 2013, 01:22:00 pm »
Dean, Jeff H, Jeremy and I, among others, did a little work on the collision detection used in DK.  Here is a summary image for those who have not seen it yet, please note that this is not 100% fact, it is a best-guess, based on current knowledge and it may change in the future.  I would like to note that this would not have been possible without the serious efforts of Dean, Jeff and Jeremy.  The 2 objects must share a minimum of 1 pixel to register a collision.  It checks for collision in the Y direction before the X direction.  It was also noticed that fireballs and foxfires can change their "y-position" while maintaining a constant X-value; they can bounce up and down.  Fireballs were seen moving up to 2 pixels vertically, and foxfires were seen up to 3 pixels above the "ground". 
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Offline xelnia

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #53 on: August 12, 2013, 01:40:13 pm »
Great information and a sweet graphic. I hope to post a large collection of information on springs in the coming days. I completely agree with the spring hitbox, mainly that there is no difference between an open or closed spring other than its visual appearance.
"Do not criticize, question, suggest or opine anything about an upcoming CAG event, no matter how constructive or positive your intent may be. You will find nothing but pain and frustration, trust me. Just go, or don't go, and :-X either way!" -ChrisP, 3/29/15
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Offline up2ng

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #54 on: August 12, 2013, 02:17:29 pm »
The 2 objects must share a minimum of 1 pixel to register a collision.  It was also noticed that fireballs and foxfires can change their "y-position" while maintaining a constant X-value; they can bounce up and down.  Fireballs were seen moving up to 2 pixels vertically, and foxfires were seen up to 3 pixels above the "ground".

Great pictures Ethan!

A couple of things about what you said above -- based on how you have drawn the boxes "between" pixels in this picture, the 2 objects actually must share 2 pixels (overlap) to be a collision.  Sharing one pixel in the hit boxes (tangent) is not a collision.

Also, I'm pretty sure both fireballs and firefoxes only move up to 2 pixels above the ground (they share all code).

Lastly, with regard to the picture, I'm pretty sure the hit boxes for Jumpman are all too skinny in the x-direction.  He has an x radius of 4 out from center, not 3.
Donkey Kong:  1,206,800  Kill Screen
Donkey Kong:  898,600     16-5
D2K:                 380,200     L=9
Donkey Kong Junior:  In Progress
Member for 11 Years DK 1.2M Point Scorer Winner of a community event Wildcard Rematch Champion Blogger Former DK Level 1-1 World Record Holder Former DK No-Hammer World Record Holder DK 1.1M Point Scorer DK 1M Point Scorer DK Killscreener Former DK World Record Holder - MAME Individual Board Record Holder Twitch Streamer

Graham Wolfe

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #55 on: August 12, 2013, 02:25:52 pm »
awesome, now if only we could get this for dkjr =)

Offline f_symbols

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #56 on: August 12, 2013, 02:29:37 pm »
man i'm not sure how i missed that for jumpman's x-values, I will fix it.  I also wanted to add the hitbox values in text (ie 4x6 for jumpman giving an 9x13 total).  Finally, with regard to in-between the pixels, i'm still somewhat confused on that;  Should I be drawing the lines to intersect the squares rather than follow their edges?

I will get these modifications done at the latest tomorrow.

Thanks again for the continued input guys!
Member for 11 Years IGBY 2016 DKF Team Member Winner of a community event Former DK Remix World Record Holder DK Remix Killscreener IGBY 2015 DKF Team Member DK 1M Point Scorer IGBY 2014 DKF Team Member Blogger DK Killscreener Twitch Streamer

Offline up2ng

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #57 on: August 12, 2013, 03:17:35 pm »
Finally, with regard to in-between the pixels, i'm still somewhat confused on that;  Should I be drawing the lines to intersect the squares rather than follow their edges?

For a graphic, you could do it either way really and in some respects yours is probably the clearest way to represent the hit boxes.  The only issue is if you were to draw a collision graphic with that type of box it will become misleading.  The reason is because your boxes will appear to overlap which will seem like it should be a collision when in fact it is NOT a collision, it is merely tangent.  Using your method for drawing the boxes, there will actually need to be TWO shared pixels in the x or y direction for there to be a collision.

The other approach would be to thicken the width of your lines to be as wide as the pixels in your graphics and then draw the box right on top of the outer pixels in the hit boxes.  This way, when two objects are colliding, it will be much more clear if they are considered to be next to each other (tangent) by the game, where your lines will simply be directly on top of each other, or if they have collided (overlap), where your lines will cross over each other (you'd probably want to use different color boxes for the two objects when doing this).  Alternatively, you could fill in the whole box to represent your hit boxes.  But, if you do it that way I'd recommend not blacking out the pixels entirely, but instead you could try to make a relatively translucent box where you can still see the pixels underneath it.

Keep up the good work!
Donkey Kong:  1,206,800  Kill Screen
Donkey Kong:  898,600     16-5
D2K:                 380,200     L=9
Donkey Kong Junior:  In Progress
Member for 11 Years DK 1.2M Point Scorer Winner of a community event Wildcard Rematch Champion Blogger Former DK Level 1-1 World Record Holder Former DK No-Hammer World Record Holder DK 1.1M Point Scorer DK 1M Point Scorer DK Killscreener Former DK World Record Holder - MAME Individual Board Record Holder Twitch Streamer

Offline up2ng

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #58 on: August 14, 2013, 08:57:16 pm »
As time allows and as I remember to do it, I'm gonna try to post my session results here in my blog.

Today's Session:

1 Hour, 24 Minutes

Starts:  0
Trips to Level 5:  0
Trips to Level 4:  0
Trips to Level 3:  1

High board:  3-2

Fail.
Donkey Kong:  1,206,800  Kill Screen
Donkey Kong:  898,600     16-5
D2K:                 380,200     L=9
Donkey Kong Junior:  In Progress
Member for 11 Years DK 1.2M Point Scorer Winner of a community event Wildcard Rematch Champion Blogger Former DK Level 1-1 World Record Holder Former DK No-Hammer World Record Holder DK 1.1M Point Scorer DK 1M Point Scorer DK Killscreener Former DK World Record Holder - MAME Individual Board Record Holder Twitch Streamer

Offline up2ng

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Re: Dean's DK Blog
« Reply #59 on: August 15, 2013, 06:41:30 pm »
Today's Session:

1 Hour, 44 Minutes

Starts:  0
Trips to Level 5:  0
Trips to Level 4:  0
Trips to Level 3:  1

High board:  3-1

Fail.
Donkey Kong:  1,206,800  Kill Screen
Donkey Kong:  898,600     16-5
D2K:                 380,200     L=9
Donkey Kong Junior:  In Progress
Member for 11 Years DK 1.2M Point Scorer Winner of a community event Wildcard Rematch Champion Blogger Former DK Level 1-1 World Record Holder Former DK No-Hammer World Record Holder DK 1.1M Point Scorer DK 1M Point Scorer DK Killscreener Former DK World Record Holder - MAME Individual Board Record Holder Twitch Streamer