Poll

Should arcade scores be allowed on the HSL that use the pace kit by Sock Master

Yes
25 (58.1%)
No
18 (41.9%)

Total Members Voted: 42

Author Topic: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit  (Read 4235 times)

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Offline johnbart

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2021, 10:38:24 am »
As someone who's long been in the "MAME is the same as arcade and should be treated as such" camp I personally would have no problems accepting scores from a kit with modifications that don't affect gameplay. They would need to be marked so that if some differences in the future were found then they could be properly moved to a separate track.

With that said I think in doing so you potentially open up the list to scrutiny from people who want/like to stir up shit. There are already people who complain loudly about magically different RNG results based on different individual boards and make unfounded accusations that somehow RNG is being manipulated. Having a modified submission would only make those kinds of statements, regardless of if they have any merit, louder.
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Offline ww

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2021, 02:15:28 pm »
Yes let's stop being silly.

Then we'd be SILLYKONG, in Sillykong Valley.
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Offline jimhappy

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #17 on: March 08, 2021, 08:16:50 am »
Noob input:

Since this topic is as emotional as it is technical, how about we simply agree to accept the opinion of the current record holders?  Maybe from anyone who has held the record in the past 5 years?  If they object, then it should not be accepted, but if they endorse it, then game-on.

I don't see why someone like me should really have the same vote.

Jim
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Offline danman123456

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #18 on: March 08, 2021, 02:26:53 pm »
100% agree. Its 2021 now not 1982. It would certainly make things more entertaining for people watching and all of this stuff is essentially available already. Other games have been "fixed" to squish bugs and actually show remaining lives left this really isn't any different IMO. Same as as Ken mentioned a High Score Save kit should be allowed. I dont think it changes the gameplay at all since most anyone who is a million point player can compute his pace almost instantly or heaven forbid tape a chart to the cab while they are playing GASP!!!
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Offline xelnia

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #19 on: March 11, 2021, 04:38:07 pm »
Right now the voting is essential 2:1 in favor of accepting these scores. It's not as big of a consensus as I hoped for, but at this point it seems likely that we can start accepting these scores. I will let the poll run a little longer. Let's get some more input from everyone (especially from those NOT in favor...don't be shy).
"Do not criticize, question, suggest or opine anything about an upcoming CAG event, no matter how constructive or positive your intent may be. You will find nothing but pain and frustration, trust me. Just go, or don't go, and :-X either way!" -ChrisP, 3/29/15
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Offline Lyriell

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #20 on: March 11, 2021, 04:52:43 pm »
I'm not in favour of it, but I'm not strongly opinionated about it.   I would assume if it's accepted, it'll be both in remix kit and rom version?

The reason I'm of two minds about it is because at some point, I'm not sure hyperawareness of pace really matters.
I still think about pace constantly... but so much of what happens is outside your control that knowing I got 55k last level is probably going to be worse for me mentally than just feeling like 'oh I had a bad level, I better try and do better this time!' 

If they're accepted, can we have them marked on the list as using the pace rom?

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Offline xelnia

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #21 on: March 11, 2021, 05:04:38 pm »
If they're accepted, can we have them marked on the list as using the pace rom?

Yes, if they're accepted they will be marked similar to other scores that use Remix kits, high score save kits, D2K kits, etc.
"Do not criticize, question, suggest or opine anything about an upcoming CAG event, no matter how constructive or positive your intent may be. You will find nothing but pain and frustration, trust me. Just go, or don't go, and :-X either way!" -ChrisP, 3/29/15
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Offline Prow

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #22 on: March 11, 2021, 06:12:49 pm »
I voted no as I share the same thoughts on this as JV posted; there's extra information being added to the game.

However, what makes this a close choice for me is tilt's post about how this pace kit works using the original ROMs and injecting data. Definitely seems highly unlikely that the gameplay is affected.
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Offline DonkeyShlong

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #23 on: March 12, 2021, 01:45:27 am »
I can understand people's apprehension about something new, but having played Pace vs my original cab, it's clear that it's just as random, bonkers and infuriating  ;D I'd argue that I've had more wild barrels in my face at level 3 on pace than I have on my cab.

I'm sure most of us would be happy with a small symbol to the side of it in the HSL just like MAME. I'd respectfully argue that to not allow and be complete purists, MAME and Arcade should have their own score lists should they not..? There are advantages to both versions depending on how comfortable you feel as a player. If you're tall, standing at a cab for hours can hurt your back and put you off your play. Some say that although MAME is identical and certainly not easier, that it's a benefit being able to sit in a comfy seat with a keyboard, allowing two inputs to more accurately pre-turn ladders. I personally just look at the skills of a player on the game and don't care about the platform, and even be cool with Switch scores.

With a Twitch stream, you can see and hear people effing and blinding at Kong, but with an INP, who is to say that they haven't been given that file by an experienced player to upload, therefore pushing legitimate players down the board? That to me is far more questionable than a 'current score' being displayed at the top of the original ROM.

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Offline GILLYKONG

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #24 on: March 12, 2021, 12:51:07 pm »
So I guess I shouldn't be silly gilly. There's all kinds of different asterix and stars already. Let's give one for the pace kit. Sock put lots of work to make it work right. let's allow it. Mark it with a sock or something lol. in case something is found to be different later. I mean I play all the Remixes and luv them so pretty much not taking them out if my PCB's  <thefinger> ROFL what's the picante.
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Offline DonkeyShlong

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #25 on: March 12, 2021, 12:53:27 pm »
Mark it with a sock or something  ROFL
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Offline DonkeyShlong

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #26 on: March 19, 2021, 11:14:20 am »
It seems like the voting is tailing off now.  What are your thoughts Jeremy?  From speaking to people who even voted no, presumably as purists, they did admit that they weren't really bothered either way.  I saw Matt playing Pace the other night with a great game going.  Pace was quite accurate mid way into the game before he lost his last life.  If the game was easier for any reason, it would be very obvious with a top tier player like Matt.

Is it looking like it's a go?  I'd love to start making it my default for my mame setup and also get it installed on my cab.  I did a test stream the other night and people were really enjoying it.
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Offline CharlieFar

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #27 on: March 19, 2021, 11:55:38 am »
Played this version with DonkeyShlong (Luke) on Twitch last week via Parsec (remote play app). I didn't feel or see any differences to the gameplay at all aside from the lag that Parsec introduces. DK was just as unreasonable as he always is.

If it's decided that the pace rom is allowable, I agree with the suggestion of marking all high scores achieved using it. That way, in the unlikely event some gameplay discrepancy comes to light, the scores can be removed to a separate table.

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Offline xelnia

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Re: Accepting Arcade Scores Using Sock's Pace Kit
« Reply #28 on: March 31, 2021, 12:09:45 am »
This wasn't as lopsided as I was hoping for, but the current/final tally is 25 for and 17 against. So, the ayes have it.

We will now accept scores performed using the Pace feature on Sock's Remix kit.

That being said, this will fall under the other kit rules, where any scores done this way run the risk of being DQ'd in the future if there are any problems found with how the kits run.
"Do not criticize, question, suggest or opine anything about an upcoming CAG event, no matter how constructive or positive your intent may be. You will find nothing but pain and frustration, trust me. Just go, or don't go, and :-X either way!" -ChrisP, 3/29/15
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